Valérien Ismaël: Blackburn Rovers Head Coach

[rigger]

2 minutes ago, ... said:

At this stage You'd have to be looking at throwing a sum at an out n out striker now. We cant keep going on amd on defensively, we need goals. Can't win without em. We've enough to cling to at the back let's go for a better top line.

 

You can also lose with them.

[DE.]

51 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

That window just gone confirms there is no goal of staying up, but no selling up goal either… why?

My guess - if we assume the aim is not to actually get relegated - is that it's a combination of arrogance and complacency from the hierarchy. They've seen us compete in and around the top half in most recent seasons without a huge outlay, so figured they could continue that trend without too many worries. They clearly aren't particularly arsed about actually being promoted, for whatever reason, but felt there was no danger in releasing a significant amount of our Championship experience and replacing it with cheap unknowns. 

It would have been obvious to anybody with any modicum of sense that this was going to be one of the most challenging seasons in terms of staying up in a while, with no obvious candidates beyond Sheffield Wednesday to go down due to the three promoted clubs being pretty strong and no other clubs looking to be in major disarray. This was not the season to take such a significant gamble.  

[Mattyblue]

That’s a potential explanation as to why they are shrugging their shoulders this season… but the second part, I.e why this interminable, joyless (on both sides) ownership never ends?

Edited 10 hours ago by Mattyblue

[DE.]

A question we've all been asking for a decade plus. Not sure there's been a situation like it at this level - not that I can recall, anyway. Disinterested, useless owners are almost always gone within a few years at most. Not ours though. 

[chaddyrovers]

3 hours ago, MarkBRFC said:

Chaddy had the correct opinion on Ismael back in March, unsure why he has flipped it back as he's done nothing to justify it.

He's a loser, who isnt being helped in anyway by the club to not be a loser.

maybe I should flip it back and we start winning games

3 hours ago, Hasta said:

I agree to a point, but also good strikers will get chances due to movement and awareness. When Szmodics was banging 30 goals in, it wasn’t cos we were supremely creative. It was mainly because his movement was top notch and the rest of the players had been coached well enough to look for that movement. Dack got a lot of goals due to his awareness in the box. He knew when to make a run and where to be to have the best chance of picking up the pieces. 

I would agree there 

35 minutes ago, ... said:

At this stage You'd have to be looking at throwing a sum at an out n out striker now. We cant keep going on amd on defensively, we need goals. Can't win without em. We've enough to cling to at the back let's go for a better top line.

 

sum? how much are talking here? 

[chaddyrovers]

4 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

He is always going to say that he wanted every signing made. It doesnt make them all sensible or good signings. And again because youll bring it up, the manager should be having final say, I dont know if Ismael does, but even if he does, it doesnt mean I have to automatically agree with those signings. Would you agree that overall recruitment this season seems very worrying?

Its not just his comments but other things around the deal when it collaspe but Rovers wanted to strike a deal for him even if he was injured which suggested he was most wanted 

I think some signings have look good like Alebiosu and Mcloughlin, whilst some we have barely seen like De Neve or Henriksson whilst someone like Tavares has look poor in recent games. Still its too early judge some signings 

4 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

Would you say that you are concerned about how bad results are this season? A record of played 10 won 2 and lost 7 just this season is terrible even if you are trying to reduce the sample size by removing last season. Im sensing a shift as before the international break you said you was confident that Ismael could turn it around. Im guessing this confidence has waned? Where do you think we will likely finish this season?

of course I am concerned about results cos I think our performances deserved more but we haven't took our chances or made a defensive mistake? 

last season is last season, has no bearing on this season performance does it? 

Its 1 game, FFS. This game was always going to tough one but we played well enough in the first half as people including were saying. I was surprised how attacking we were and I thought we would sit in much much. 

not in the bottom 3

[roversfan99]

13 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Its not just his comments but other things around the deal when it collaspe but Rovers wanted to strike a deal for him even if he was injured which suggested he was most wanted 

I think some signings have look good like Alebiosu and Mcloughlin, whilst some we have barely seen like De Neve or Henriksson whilst someone like Tavares has look poor in recent games. Still its too early judge some signings 

of course I am concerned about results cos I think our performances deserved more but we haven't took our chances or made a defensive mistake? 

last season is last season, has no bearing on this season performance does it? 

Its 1 game, FFS. This game was always going to tough one but we played well enough in the first half as people including were saying. I was surprised how attacking we were and I thought we would sit in much much. 

not in the bottom 3

Even if he did personally want these deals. Its likely that he merely agreed at the end, I doubt he was the one picking them. But either way, it doesnt justify them.

You say it is only 1 game, he isnt the main problem at the club but I wanted Ismael to go BEFORE that. Its you that has changed from telling me before it that you have faith in Ismael before that, to now opening up the possibility of making a change at the next international break. What sort of situation would lead you to think we should change then, if we are still in the bottom 3? Is there a certain amount of points we would need for him to keep his job?

Im not having these hard luck stories, we dont deserve more. I anticipate more of this, us being competitive in most games but a lack of defensive organisation costing us at one end, an inability to score goals costing us at the other, and a lack of experience on the field and quality in the dugout leading us to fail to manage games properly to get results. Even under Coyle, we were competitive in most games.

And we are 22nd. Last time I checked, that was in the bottom 3. Or are you saying that you expect us to stay up, rather than we arent there now? In which case, even if we do avoid relegation, which I think is at best in the balance, its a massive downgrade from where you said we would finish previously.

Edited 9 hours ago by roversfan99

[...]

51 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

maybe I should flip it back and we start winning games

I would agree there 

sum? how much are talking here? 

What do I know I don't hold the money.

[Tomphil2]

2 hours ago, DE. said:

If you can't afford a decent outlay on a striker, then your next best bet is to make your team defensive and hard to beat. Squeeze out victories from small margins and concede as few as possible. We sold our last reliable, experienced defender at the end of the transfer window instead. Gross incompetence if the goal is to stay in the division. 

It's the attitude of oh we can replace Brittain, Hyam, Travis etc for a few hundred grand a piece and much cheaper wages as they ain't all that.

Sadly that attitude is shared and even pushed by some of our so called hardcore fans. Funny how the poster guilty of it most on here always disappears when things are going wrong then re-emerges at window time with the same rhetoric for the next player due to be sold.

If that kind of thinking is being gleaned from coaches at the club who are following the lead set down by shadow man and his apprentice it's no wonder we are in a mess.

Naivety, stupidity or just gaslighting call it what you will but it's an issue at the club and amongst fans willing to swallow whatever the get fed.

[chaddyrovers]

53 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Even if he did personally want these deals. Its likely that he merely agreed at the end, I doubt he was the one picking them. But either way, it doesnt justify them.

feck me, you won't let it go will you! 

53 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

You say it is only 1 game, he isnt the main problem at the club but I wanted Ismael to go BEFORE that. Its you that has changed from telling me before it that you have faith in Ismael before that, to now opening up the possibility of making a change at the next international break. What sort of situation would lead you to think we should change then, if we are still in the bottom 3? Is there a certain amount of points we would need for him to keep his job?

I have said very clearly what I will do, I will repeat "I will post my opinion then RF99 for the board to see"

53 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Im not having these hard luck stories, we dont deserve more. I anticipate more of this, us being competitive in most games but a lack of defensive organisation costing us at one end, an inability to score goals costing us at the other, and a lack of experience on the field and quality in the dugout leading us to fail to manage games properly to get results. 

yes we do deserve more 

53 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

And we are 22nd. Last time I checked, that was in the bottom 3. Or are you saying that you expect us to stay up, rather than we arent there now? In which case, even if we do avoid relegation, which I think is at best in the balance, its a massive downgrade from where you said we would finish previously.

I said not in the Bottom 3. 

[roversfan99]

6 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

feck me, you won't let it go will you! 

I have said very clearly what I will do, I will repeat "I will post my opinion then RF99 for the board to see"

yes we do deserve more 

I said not in the Bottom 3. 

You get what you deserve. Take the Birmingham game, if our players picked by our manager made mistakes leading to 2 goals, how do we not deserve that?

There is a lot of evasion for fear of knowing that if you say he needs x points or to be in x position before the next break to keep his job, you wont look as silly when you continue to back him.

[chaddyrovers]

3 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

You get what you deserve. Take the Birmingham game, if our players picked by our manager made mistakes leading to 2 goals, how do we not deserve that?

Look at the overall game when we were the better team and for the vast majority of that game. Birmingham were poor for most of that game. and like I said their big money striker Kyogo Furuhashi was awful. 9m on him, what a waste of money 

3 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

There is a lot of evasion for fear of knowing that if you say he needs x points or to be in x position before the next break to keep his job, you wont look as silly when you continue to back him.

You have been told what I will do and when. You always asked this and that trying to box people into a position, I won't play your silly bloody games

[roversfan99]

But we only managed to score 1 goal in this apparent majority of dominant play (which is IMO untrue) and conceded 2 through the opponents quality and our incompetent defending. Therefore, we deserved what we got. 

[chaddyrovers]

7 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

But we only managed to score 1 goal in this apparent majority of dominant play (which is IMO untrue) and conceded 2 through the opponents quality and our incompetent defending. Therefore, we deserved what we got. 

We won't agree so what the point in continue this discussion, utter pointless. We have more than once discuss this game and we don't agree and won't. Any point continuing it? 

[Mercer]

If you can't win when you are playing well just when the feck will you win!?!?

A three and a half year contract for a man with Ismael's record is ridiculous - IMO, it stinks.

Think Pasha and Gestede, aided and abetted by Ismael have transformed a very decent team that narrowly missed out on the play-offs to a team that will be embroiled in a relegation scrap and are unlikely to come through unscathed.

 

[roversfan99]

You tend to get what you deserve in football. Its loser talk to bemoan how you deserve more.

Even if a team has constant pressure on the opposition goal, keeps missing their chances then concedes a sloppy goal or two at the other end, they dont "deserve" to win yet that tends to be the narrative. 

(Not that it was the case in our games)

If you keep finding yourself on the wrong side of games, its not bad luck or undeserved.

[JHRover]

A lot of this comes back to Gestede and the inexplicable decision to hand him control of the footballing operation overnight despite him having absolutely zero by way of experience or track record to justify it. 

Something very, very strange and probably dodgy going on there with that one especially when we factor in the bizarre period pre-appointment where he was following Waggott around to meetings and loitering around the training ground - again just not what happens in modern day professional high level football.

If you want a new director of football or 'head of' you identify suitable options from a range of backgrounds and experiences and then you whittle the list down and plump for a choice. 

None of that here though, oh no, we go straight for a friendly face, I bet there was no recruitment process the job was his the minute they managed to get Broughton down the road. 

Why and how it came about more mystery. But as we've seen here countless times with randomers being parachuted into top jobs, going right back to the first major decision the scum made in 2010, they seem to enjoy this sort of thing.

The idea of having a thorough due process and ending with someone getting a job running the show who is unconnected and has a CV that stands up to scrutiny unheard of - it's jobs for the boys and who you know not what you know.

In his haste to make a name for himself Gestede's recruitment probably the final nail in our coffin. I'm sure there will be people along sooner rather than later to explain how we couldn't remain competitive on our finances/crowds in this league, despite Eustace doing just that with his wheeling and dealing last summer.

So why was that 'model' that was working well under a competent manager so radically and suddenly ditched? 

The answer I suspect is all to allow Rudy and his chums to get to work and 'do their bit' whilst 'proving himself'.

Unfortunately that gamble/experiment will probably finish off Blackburn Rovers in its current form. 

[den]

You could almost believe that Venkys “had” to commit to putting in an annual amount of cash for the sale from the Walker family to go through. Since then they’ve spent 15 years selling anyone and everyone in a simple attempt to recoup as much as possible. Thats all they do.

[Leonard Venkhater]

7 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Its not just his comments but other things around the deal when it collaspe but Rovers wanted to strike a deal for him even if he was injured which suggested he was most wanted 

I think some signings have look good like Alebiosu and Mcloughlin, whilst some we have barely seen like De Neve or Henriksson whilst someone like Tavares has look poor in recent games. Still its too early judge some signings 

of course I am concerned about results cos I think our performances deserved more but we haven't took our chances or made a defensive mistake? 

last season is last season, has no bearing on this season performance does it? 

Its 1 game, FFS. This game was always going to tough one but we played well enough in the first half as people including were saying. I was surprised how attacking we were and I thought we would sit in much much. 

not in the bottom 3

Look at his overall managerial record in England. You've got to wonder whether he'd have got a job at any other club..

[Tomphil2]

38 minutes ago, den said:

You could almost believe that Venkys “had” to commit to putting in an annual amount of cash for the sale from the Walker family to go through. Since then they’ve spent 15 years selling anyone and everyone in a simple attempt to recoup as much as possible. Thats all they do.

To pass the fit and proper they had to prove good cash flow and agree to cover losses and that was about it i assume.

 

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

47 minutes ago, Leonard Venkhater said:

Look at his overall managerial record in England. You've got to wonder whether he'd have got a job at any other club local Tesco.