150th Anniversary kit/celebrations

[Upside Down]

7 hours ago, j166429 said:

Are we even sure that it has been proven beyond doubt that the white shirt with a maltese cross was our first ever shirt? (i know what it says on the rovers' website, but do we have any factual evidence?)

No.

It's a complete fiction.

In reproduced minutes supposedly of the initial meeting for the Foundation of the club (the date of this meeting is also up for debate) it was suggested that this would be the uniform worn by players. This is a suggestion in a meeting. I could suggest in a fans forum meeting that venkys sell up and fuck off but that doesn't mean it actually happens.

Absolutely zero evidence to suggest the team ever played in those colours and everything to suggest we've always played in Blue and White halves (quarters). The fact that the founders took inspiration from their school that wore this same pattern, except swapping green for blue, suggests that it is far far more likely that the blue and white shirts are what we've always worn.

This white shirt bollocks is on a football shirt website and that's it. No other sources contemporary to the time make any mention of this because it never happened. 

Edited 16 hours ago by Upside Down

[davulsukur]

3 hours ago, J*B said:

Can you upload pictures of the two pages?

I second this

[chaddyrovers]

Its great seeing all these videos from former players congratulations to Rovers on their 150th Birthday. 

King Kenny, Tim Sherwood and Mark Atkins were special ones for me. same as Kuqi, Bentley and Friedel 

[JHRover]

Standard Rovers playbook - get former players to record messages and send them in - easy and cheap

Where are the other announcements they were going to make over the course of the day?

I've seen the embarrassing 'VH Group' pages of the book. 

Amateur hour. 

The piece is written by a third party heaping praise on the owners for their impact on the club but really is just reciting what happened when they darkened our door in 2010.

Yet beneath the piece it is signed off as 'VH Group' as though they wrote it, which they obviously didn't. 

Two photographs used - one when the Queen came to Ewood and they turned up for their big moment and the other with the two idiot brothers at a game. The caption erroneously states that the photo is at Ewood for a game against Aston Villa, which is incorrect, the photo used is from the final game of the season at Wolves when their operation to relegate us nearly came to fruition in their first season.

Obviously there's zero reference to any accomplishments beyond becoming the first Indian owners of a (former) PL Club, vague references to investments in the Club and town (no specifics) and the Queen visiting. Quite the highlights reel from 15 years of ownership. Clearly no sporting accomplishments to mention nor any recent photos given their absence and no comments from the villains themselves who couldn't even make the effort for this occasion.

Edited 15 hours ago by JHRover

[...]

6 minutes ago, JHRover said:

Standard Rovers playbook - get former players to record messages and send them in - easy and cheap

Where are the other announcements they were going to make over the course of the day?

I've seen the embarrassing 'VH Group' pages of the book. 

Amateur hour. 

The piece is written by a third party heaping praise on the owners for their impact on the club but really is just reciting what happened when they darkened our door in 2010.

Yet beneath the piece it is signed off as 'VH Group' as though they wrote it, which they obviously didn't. 

Two photographs used - one when the Queen came to Ewood and they turned up for their big moment and the other with the two idiot brothers at a game. The caption erroneously states that the photo is at Ewood for a game against Aston Villa, which is incorrect, the photo used is from the final game of the season at Wolves when their operation to relegate us nearly came to fruition in their first season.

Obviously there's zero reference to any accomplishments beyond becoming the first Indian owners of a (former) PL Club, vague references to investments in the Club and town (no specifics) and the Queen visiting. Quite the highlights reel from 15 years of ownership. Clearly no sporting accomplishments to mention nor any recent photos given their absence and no comments from the villains themselves who couldn't even make the effort for this occasion.

Pure embarrassment and anger at how this had all been handled. 

[Herbie6590]

1 hour ago, davulsukur said:

I second this

C/o New York Rovers on Twitter

[StHelensRover]

9 minutes ago, Herbie6590 said:

C/o New York Rovers on Twitter

Wow, won't be parting with £40 or however much it is for a book with a full page glossy photo of those jokers. They should have just swallowed their pride and omitted themselves from the book. 

[Herbie6590]

42 minutes ago, JHRover said:

Standard Rovers playbook - get former players to record messages and send them in - easy and cheap

Where are the other announcements they were going to make over the course of the day?

I've seen the embarrassing 'VH Group' pages of the book. 

Amateur hour. 

The piece is written by a third party heaping praise on the owners for their impact on the club but really is just reciting what happened when they darkened our door in 2010.

Yet beneath the piece it is signed off as 'VH Group' as though they wrote it, which they obviously didn't. 

Two photographs used - one when the Queen came to Ewood and they turned up for their big moment and the other with the two idiot brothers at a game. The caption erroneously states that the photo is at Ewood for a game against Aston Villa, which is incorrect, the photo used is from the final game of the season at Wolves when their operation to relegate us nearly came to fruition in their first season.

Obviously there's zero reference to any accomplishments beyond becoming the first Indian owners of a (former) PL Club, vague references to investments in the Club and town (no specifics) and the Queen visiting. Quite the highlights reel from 15 years of ownership. Clearly no sporting accomplishments to mention nor any recent photos given their absence and no comments from the villains themselves who couldn't even make the effort for this occasion.

 

[davulsukur]

18 minutes ago, Herbie6590 said:

C/o New York Rovers on Twitter

Thanks!

15 years of ownership and the only highlights they can come up with is signing Jordan Rhodes and Her Majesty turning up which was completely unrelated to the owners.

Edited 14 hours ago by davulsukur

[Upside Down]

16 minutes ago, Herbie6590 said:

C/o New York Rovers on Twitter

The only thing that is any good for is the fire. 

Anything other than an absolutely scathing and brutal dissection of their tenure renders the rest of the book completely and utterly invalid.

[Salgados Hair]

'Over the past 15 years, VH Group has made a lasting impact on Blackburn..'

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/news/14575152.blackburn-rovers-store-town-centre-set-close/

[Parsonblue]

2 hours ago, Upside Down said:

No.

It's a complete fiction.

In reproduced minutes supposedly of the initial meeting for the Foundation of the club (the date of this meeting is also up for debate) it was suggested that this would be the uniform worn by players. This is a suggestion in a meeting. I could suggest in a fans forum meeting that venkys sell up and fuck off but that doesn't mean it actually happens.

Absolutely zero evidence to suggest the team ever played in those colours and everything to suggest we've always played in Blue and White halves (quarters). The fact that the founders took inspiration from their school that wore this same pattern, except swapping green for blue, suggests that it is far far more likely that the blue and white shirts are what we've always worn.

This white shirt bollocks is on a football shirt website and that's it. No other sources contemporary to the time make any mention of this because it never happened. 

There is no primary source ( or zero evidence, as you put it) to suggest that the club played in Blue & White during their first season.  There is a primary source, published by the club in 1909, that shows that the club passed a motion to play in white shirts with a blue Maltese cross.  This was proposed and seconded by founder members of the club.  By the time of the first known photograph (circa 1878/1879) they were in shirts which some players had white on the right hand side and some had white on the left hand side.

 

[Parsonblue]

57 minutes ago, Upside Down said:

The only thing that is any good for is the fire. 

Anything other than an absolutely scathing and brutal dissection of their tenure renders the rest of the book completely and utterly invalid.

The book records the history of the club.  How is the history of our club invalid?  

[RevidgeBlue]

14 minutes ago, Parsonblue said:

There is no primary source ( or zero evidence, as you put it) to suggest that the club played in Blue & White during their first season.  There is a primary source, published by the club in 1909, that shows that the club passed a motion to play in white shirts with a blue Maltese cross.  This was proposed and seconded by founder members of the club.  By the time of the first known photograph (circa 1878/1879) they were in shirts which some players had white on the right hand side and some had white on the left hand side.

 

Disagree on this Parson - whilst a motion may have been passed at some point that we should play in white shirts,  there's no evidence to say we actually did so, whether it be for a week, a month or a season.

Who's to say there wasn't a change of heart the following week? Either way by 1878 we were already in the recognisable blue and white halves, not just shirts with white in as you're making out above, so any period we did play in white for must have been so insignificant as to be virtually irrelevant.

"The choice of Club Colours also had its roots in the Public School background which so many of its members shared. Both of the Hargreaves brothers and Doc Greenwood were Old Malvernians and it was decided to copy their quartered shirt design, but to replace the traditional green with a Cambridge blue."

Blackburn Rovers - The Complete Record Mike Jackman 2009.

That information is logical and consistent. What was the original source for that assertion and why is it suddenly any less compelling than some minutes which seem to have subsequently come to light?

[...]

5 hours ago, Salgados Hair said:

'Over the past 15 years, VH Group has made a lasting impact on Blackburn..'

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/news/14575152.blackburn-rovers-store-town-centre-set-close/

Well they aren't bloody wrong!

[Mattyblue]

Is there confirmed evidence that the club badge of Blackburn Rovers, not a few Old Malverians that played for it was the Maltese Cross? 

Edited 5 hours ago by Mattyblue

[Herbie6590]

23 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

Is there confirmed evidence that the club badge of Blackburn Rovers, not a few Old Malverians that played for it was the Maltese Cross? 

There are photographs in this thread of the team at Alexandra Meadows wearing shirts with the badge

[47er]

9 hours ago, StHelensRover said:

Wow, won't be parting with £40 or however much it is for a book with a full page glossy photo of those jokers. They should have just swallowed their pride and omitted themselves from the book. 

I'm assuming Rovers commissioned an author to write the book but retained control over what was in it and what wasn't?

There are some "tricky"areas for Pasha and Co from recent times.

I can't see them allowing free rein, not in their DNA.

 

[Mattyblue]

Not all of them are, that’s my point (and they are playing in blue and white to boot).

So why has it now become accepted history that the Maltese Cross was our first badge, not merely that of some of the schools the players were alumni of?

[Herbie6590]

10 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

Not all of them are, that’s my point (and they are playing in blue and white to boot).

So why has it now become accepted history that the Maltese Cross was our first badge, not merely that of some of the schools the players were alumni of?

@Parsonblue has repeatedly posted in this thread with details of the minutes of the formation meeting. Just look higher up this page. 

We seem to be repeating ourselves in this thread every few pages…🤷‍♂️

[Mattyblue]

‘Proposed’. No evidence of it. The club didn’t have a ‘badge’ until the 1970s.

[Parsonblue]

9 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Disagree on this Parson - whilst a motion may have been passed at some point that we should play in white shirts,  there's no evidence to say we actually did so, whether it be for a week, a month or a season.

Who's to say there wasn't a change of heart the following week? Either way by 1878 we were already in the recognisable blue and white halves, not just shirts with white in as you're making out above, so any period we did play in white for must have been so insignificant as to be virtually irrelevant.

"The choice of Club Colours also had its roots in the Public School background which so many of its members shared. Both of the Hargreaves brothers and Doc Greenwood were Old Malvernians and it was decided to copy their quartered shirt design, but to replace the traditional green with a Cambridge blue."

Blackburn Rovers - The Complete Record Mike Jackman 2009.

That information is logical and consistent. What was the original source for that assertion and why is it suddenly any less compelling than some minutes which seem to have subsequently come to light?

History changes as new primary source material comes available Rev.  New things about our club's history continually come to light as we discover new primary sources.  There is a huge amount of new things I've discovered about our club since that book was published.  That is the continual fascination with history.

[Parsonblue]

58 minutes ago, Herbie6590 said:

@Parsonblue has repeatedly posted in this thread with details of the minutes of the formation meeting. Just look higher up this page. 

We seem to be repeating ourselves in this thread every few pages…🤷‍♂️

Agreed.  Apologies for that.  At the end of the day people will believe what they want. Personally, until I see evidence to the contrary, I'm sticking with the white shirt for the initial games and then at some point in the first two seasons it changed to a form of blue and white.  

[Mattyblue]

The club, for a very short period, may well have worn a white shirt, no pictorial evidence, but ok.

A few players with certain Midland public school connections may well have worn a Maltese Cross, certainly an interesting tidbit. 

However, Blackburn Rovers, if known for anything is our unique blue and white, the blue and white all our achievements have been enveloped in… yet, the regime has ignored all that and focused relentlessly on the Maltese Cross which was a mere footnote of our wonderful heritage, why?
 

[Hasta]

So the historical kits website had access to the 1905 information which stated what the 1875 minutes state (there's no evidence that this decision wasn't changed at a later meeting or before the first game. We will never know how much information in those original minutes ever came to fruition).

Based on this Historical Kits have created a mock up kit with no access to the size of the Maltese Cross, nor the shade of Blue and put it on their website.

And the club have taken that as gospel and recreated it?

Anyone with half a brain would chose the second one from the list if you wanted the cross on a historical Rovers shirt. Or find the earliest photographic evidence available of any rovers shirt and recreate that one.

 

Edited 2 hours ago by Hasta