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Just now, Dreams of 1995 said:

Despite a rather unlucky own goal I quite liked the look of Carter last night. He got skinned a few times and to be honest Luton's attackers were poor but he dealt with most things well enough.

Can't help but feel that Rankin-Costello has way more to offer us going forward than he does at left back. People cried out for Chapman's crosses but he delivered a good few in yesterday and no one got on the end of them. His first touch and pass is excellent too. I like him.

Buckley had a decent run about when he came on. You can see the quality in that boy. He did a brilliant first time pass to Bradley Johnson as the ball was coming down that Johnson was far too slow to read. On Johnson - worst player on the pitch yesterday. I'm done with him.

I'm enjoying watching us have so many academy players in our squad at the moment, and really do think they are quality enough to come good. You can see that the young lads on the pitch are all steps ahead of Johnson, Bennett, Bell, Williams etc. Mowbray needs to decide what his aims are, if we can't afford to go out and buy players then commit to a plan and give these players the time they deserve.

JRC needs to be played further up the pitch, maybe out wide and Buckley needs to play more games in a midfield 3 with Travis and Evans. Does anyone know what has happened to Butterworth? He looked a real player in his couple of appearances a while back and I thought he'd be knocking on the door this season. 

 

Butterworth has/had a " back injury ". Having a back injury that lasts for such a long period isn't a good sign. Disc trouble can sometimes be a friend for life, especially if it doesn't clear up quickly. Like you I was expecting him to be knocking on the door this season, he looked a real prospect.

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The own goal was unfortunate but the real issue was letting the Luton player win the first header. Not defending balls into our penalty area properly has been a real Achilles Heel under Mowbray. Even in League One it was our vulnerability.

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Just now, arbitro said:

The own goal was unfortunate but the real issue was letting the Luton player win the first header. Not defending balls into our penalty area properly has been a real Achilles Heel under Mowbray. Even in League One it was our vulnerability.

That defence was crying out for a Pontus Janson in it last season. No amount of training can force a player to put their head to it in a game situation. We just don't have the players for it. 

Bradley Johnson is meant to be brilliant in the air but I don't see it defensively myself. He's a lost cause for Rovers and clearly disinterested. 

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40 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

 

 Does anyone know what has happened to Butterworth? He looked a real player in his couple of appearances a while back and I thought he'd be knocking on the door this season. 

 

He's been out with a back injury but is on the way back to fitness.

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A few people saying Carter looked decent last night. I'm not writing him off by any means. But he certainly didn't look remotely ready on last nights showing. 

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Just now, ben_the_beast said:

A few people saying Carter looked decent last night. I'm not writing him off by any means. But he certainly didn't look remotely ready on last nights showing. 

As I saw it he would have been behind Lenihan Abbi, Mulgrew, Williams, Wharton, Platt, Magloire and Grayson at the start of the season. That makes him 9th in line. So no surprises he looked lost.

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I think people are perhaps being a little kind on the Academy players because obviously they are young lads which I can understand. But lets at least be truthful about their readiness at the moment. Have we got a clutch of young lads ready to become first teamers in the immediate future? I would say no.

Carter I felt was really out of his depth and for me its putting a brave face on it saying otherwise. It wasnt just the own goal, which wasnt merely unfortunate either. He looked a little ragged all game, misplaced square passes, loose touches especially when they tried to get in behind, he often appeared clumsy and ponderous. 6 goals conceded in 2 games, obviously not solely down to him but its not the best dress rehearsal. If hes in the immediate vicinity of the first team next season then we may have a problem. We can only hope that we can find a freebie or two to improve our flimsy defence which has conceded 132 goals since promotion 2 years ago. You would also presume that Wharton has shown far more competence when out on loan, but equally surely theres no chance that he can push to start.

Rankin Costello I think has got some praise a little overboard considering his performances, which have come well out of position in fairness. He shouldnt be in our back 4. There is definitely more to work with although going forward, although for me he often holds onto tbe ball for a second or two longer than necessary, and I have found his end product to be lacking so far, a few crosses right into the srand.

I dont see where Buckley comes into the first team picture at the moment either. Hes neat and tidy but quite clearly not natural out wide nor physical enough to dictate from deep. And hes well down the list to play as a number 10.

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Gets me too annoyed to watch match on I-follow, but I thought the vast majority on here knew that Luton would win,  so were right.

What got me angry before(and happened again last night) was at Barnsley all the action/cajoling was coming from the opposition Manager and TM was sat there looking exasperated and helpless.

TM was a strong defender himself. Defence is helped by a strong midfield. The forwards help by keeping the ball. The full-backs should try to prevent as many crosses as possible. Players confidence can be knocked by being played out of position. Young players have more energy than older players.

Our great batch of young players have at least had more experience but If TM could sort out most of these key issues, at last we could have a fighting chance against motivated but less skilfull sides.

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In a perfect world young players go out on loan to make their mistakes at other clubs. 

However, in the past young players came into the first team and often made howlers, but the good ones came through that initial baptism of fire and went on to have good careers with the club and elsewhere.

If money is tight that it may well that those youngsters have to learn from their mistakes whilst playing in the Championship with Rovers.  Supporters will have to show patience with these youngsters and help get them through that initial learning period.  I have no doubt that Joe Rankin-Costello and John Buckley are going to be regulars in the senior squad next season.  Carter may go out on loan if we are able to bring in a replacement for Tosin - if not then he will be alongside Magloire, Wharton and Grayson as a member of the senior squad.  

 

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Posted (edited)
22 minutes ago, Parsonblue said:

Carter may go out on loan if we are able to bring in a replacement for Tosin - if not then he will be alongside Magloire, Wharton and Grayson as a member of the senior squad.  

 

We're in big trouble if all four of those are part of the senior squad and get much game time next season (Wharton possibly excepted as he's racked up quite a lot of senior experience, even if it's in League Two). Grayson and Magloire are both 21 and have barely played any senior football between them - that suggests they're nowhere near ready for the Championship any time soon, and maybe never will be.

If money is so tight that it means 'defenders aren't coming', then I expect our recent defensive woes to continue next season.

Edited by frosty

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I have a sneaking suspicion that the players were quietly prepared to lose the game last night. No joy whatsoever from them after Armstrong's early goal.

The hostility towards Wigan following the fallout from Dack's injury still runs deep I believe. 

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I can't help but feel that these 'youngsters' we keep hearing so much about are actually miles away from being ready for the Championship. Which is worrying as these are 17-18 year old kids that we are talking these are players that are 20+, you'd expect them to be showing signs of being ready for Championship football. But the only player of the youngsters who looks ready for any Championship football is JRC although in a role further forward than the full back role he has been playing. 

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9 minutes ago, Colt Seavers said:

I have a sneaking suspicion that the players were quietly prepared to lose the game last night. No joy whatsoever from them after Armstrong's early goal.

The hostility towards Wigan following the fallout from Dack's injury still runs deep I believe. 

Our result last night had no bearing on Wigan staying up or going down. 

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10 minutes ago, Colt Seavers said:

I have a sneaking suspicion that the players were quietly prepared to lose the game last night. No joy whatsoever from them after Armstrong's early goal.

The hostility towards Wigan following the fallout from Dack's injury still runs deep I believe. 

If you read what Mowbray had to say before the game it's no wonder we lost.

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14 minutes ago, Colt Seavers said:

I have a sneaking suspicion that the players were quietly prepared to lose the game last night. No joy whatsoever from them after Armstrong's early goal.

The hostility towards Wigan following the fallout from Dack's injury still runs deep I believe. 

I hope that is the case.

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2 minutes ago, Ewood Ace said:

Our result last night had no bearing on Wigan staying up or going down. 

They are footballers , they may not have worked that out.

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2 hours ago, Parsonblue said:

In a perfect world young players go out on loan to make their mistakes at other clubs. 

However, in the past young players came into the first team and often made howlers, but the good ones came through that initial baptism of fire and went on to have good careers with the club and elsewhere.

If money is tight that it may well that those youngsters have to learn from their mistakes whilst playing in the Championship with Rovers.  Supporters will have to show patience with these youngsters and help get them through that initial learning period.  I have no doubt that Joe Rankin-Costello and John Buckley are going to be regulars in the senior squad next season.  Carter may go out on loan if we are able to bring in a replacement for Tosin - if not then he will be alongside Magloire, Wharton and Grayson as a member of the senior squad.  

 

It's not about a pretentious notion of calling people out for not having the required patience with youngsters. People should be free to judge on whether they feel the youngsters are in a position to compete and improve us, and comment on their performances.

Rankin Costello seems the one with the main chance, we have a dearth of wide men and he fits the bill. In all but one of his first team starts, he has been played out of position which is a concern. I personally have found the praise to be a little over the top, probably considering that he is an academy kid which I can understand. He seems technically ok but he certainly isnt very fast, and he seems quite ponderous when approaching the opposition box, whilst his final product has been lacking with quite a few wayward crosses. 

With Buckley, his limitations are obvious, albeit his style is a little more obvious too, neat and tidy, technically good. Problem for him is where does he get in? We already have numerous options ahead of him as a 10 and I cant see him having an effect anywhere else. 

With Carter, he seems well, well off at the moment. Magloire seemed similar last season, and Grayson I only saw v Oldham where again he was off the standard. Wharton may prove a different player post his loan spells but a replacement for Tosin is not already at the club, so we have to find a replacement, even if its a freebie.

The biggest defenders of Mowbray revert back to the minimal points increase as a sign of progress but ultimately in the situation we are in, it is totally meaningless too if next season any tiny shoots of progress regarding points finishes is reversed due to the economic climate, showing the sadly fanciful idea of a slow build.

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A blast from the past, well back in September 2019

“We should be beating teams like Luton Town with total respect to them''

Classic Moanbray

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Just read the match report on the LT, the comments ^_^

Rows and scores being settled all the way down, proper abusive, and they have the nerve to slag off brfcs on there! This place is most civilised in comparison.

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2 hours ago, Mattyblue said:

Just read the match report on the LT, the comments ^_^

Rows and scores being settled all the way down, proper abusive, and they have the nerve to slag off brfcs on there! This place is most civilised in comparison.

I gave up reading LT comments years ago but Facebook gets vile. I just read it LOL. They swear more than I do ! BRFCS is a haven of tranquility in comparison.

 

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On 22/07/2020 at 23:49, S8 & Blue said:

Our defence is better, and we counter better.

We can’t break teams down, we missed Dack and Holtby has been a poor replacement.

Our defence is better? We've shipped goals for fun. Not suprising when you have makeshift fullbacks and a keeper who has really struggled.

It all goes back to the transfer policy.

 

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On 23/07/2020 at 12:08, Ewood Ace said:

I can't help but feel that these 'youngsters' we keep hearing so much about are actually miles away from being ready for the Championship. Which is worrying as these are 17-18 year old kids that we are talking these are players that are 20+, you'd expect them to be showing signs of being ready for Championship football. But the only player of the youngsters who looks ready for any Championship football is JRC although in a role further forward than the full back role he has been playing. 

If you've got a solid basis then you can experiment with young players. If we sort out the defence and keeper I think the likes of Buckley, JRC and Davenport can kick on.

Not sure we can really afford to rely on Carter though. We need a top experienced gk, centreback, left back then we can probably accommodate Nyambes development.

As it is we are so brittle on the defence.

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We conceded 63, was 69 last season, so ‘progress’, like accruing 3 extra points, I suppose...

But no clean sheets in the last 11 games is a large reason we missed out..

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On 23/07/2020 at 10:28, Parsonblue said:

In a perfect world young players go out on loan to make their mistakes at other clubs. 

However, in the past young players came into the first team and often made howlers, but the good ones came through that initial baptism of fire and went on to have good careers with the club and elsewhere.

If money is tight that it may well that those youngsters have to learn from their mistakes whilst playing in the Championship with Rovers.  Supporters will have to show patience with these youngsters and help get them through that initial learning period.  I have no doubt that Joe Rankin-Costello and John Buckley are going to be regulars in the senior squad next season.  Carter may go out on loan if we are able to bring in a replacement for Tosin - if not then he will be alongside Magloire, Wharton and Grayson as a member of the senior squad. 

I think on the whole fans of Rovers will show patience for our youngsters, Parson. Football forums are usually quite critical places but there's one or two posters on here that take the biscuit with the criticisms of youth players.

JRC and Buckley have looked good when played. I'll be honest, I have a soft spot with Rankin-Costello because he won the World Player of the Year for me on Football Manager once (tongue in cheek before the Sky Sports stat debate squad jump on me). In all seriousness though I know I am not the only one that is enjoying seeing the academy players push their way into the first team squad. I'm looking forward to seeing more of Carter in truth, I don't think he looked bad in his two games for us. He looks tall, composed enough on the ball and if he can cut them silly sideways passes out of his game he can be a real player. Tosin stands above him and Lenihan because he can pass forward every time. He's going to be a miss next season. In reality I think Carter would be more suited to a loan move away and for us to try and bring in a centre back and have Wharton as our 3rd choice.

In the absence of funds these boys will have to step up and show what they are made of. 

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Posted (edited)
26 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

I think on the whole fans of Rovers will show patience for our youngsters, Parson. Football forums are usually quite critical places but there's one or two posters on here that take the biscuit with the criticisms of youth players.

JRC and Buckley have looked good when played. I'll be honest, I have a soft spot with Rankin-Costello because he won the World Player of the Year for me on Football Manager once (tongue in cheek before the Sky Sports stat debate squad jump on me). In all seriousness though I know I am not the only one that is enjoying seeing the academy players push their way into the first team squad. I'm looking forward to seeing more of Carter in truth, I don't think he looked bad in his two games for us. He looks tall, composed enough on the ball and if he can cut them silly sideways passes out of his game he can be a real player. Tosin stands above him and Lenihan because he can pass forward every time. He's going to be a miss next season. In reality I think Carter would be more suited to a loan move away and for us to try and bring in a centre back and have Wharton as our 3rd choice.

In the absence of funds these boys will have to step up and show what they are made of. 

Regarding centre backs I think you need three first choice plus one that can play there without maybe being as good as the other three but not far behind in terms of ability and a young one who can come in and do a good job there at a pinch. I'd put Wharton in the latter category if he's made sufficient progress on loan

Our centre halves seem to be prone to injuries and all centre halves will be picking up the odd suspension if they're doing the job properly so you need quite a few of them.

Edited by Tyrone Shoelaces

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