[Archived] Summer Transfer/discussion Thread

[deryck guyler's spoon]

Still desperately short of pace up top and have been for how many years now? We need something else what we already have else we're going to be too predictable.

Wasn't Delphy a bit nippy? ( yes and crap, I know). I seem to remember him being quick when he came through at Villa.

Pace comes at a price I reckon, so we either have to get lucky or look at other ways of hurting opponents.

[Neal]

I asked Nicko about the striker loan player Coyle wants.

Says Coyle is waiting for the team to release the player on loan. He is a pacey type striker. Wont say the name tho

Didn't know we were interested in one. Guessing it's someone at a prem club then.

Wasn't Delphy a bit nippy? ( yes and crap, I know). I seem to remember him being quick when he came through at Villa.

Pace comes at a price I reckon, so we either have to get lucky or look at other ways of hurting opponents.

I see what you're saying, like Tom I was a little disappointed we didn't keep Simeon Jackson on... Obviously not a world beater but showed a good work rate and managed a few goals too, ideal for cup comps and surely would't have demanded the earth in wages. Delfuenso's movement didn't give us enough of an outlet IMO, someone a bit smaller and a bit nippier would be more ideal.

[JAL]

I said two days ago Coyle would start praising Wharton to ease the departure of Hanley. It's getting easier and easier to predict what's going to happen at Ewood. Might get a job as a Journo.......

Problem is Owen Coyle isnt very good at football so anything he says must surely lack any credibility.

[chaddyrovers]

Didn't know we were interested in one. Guessing it's someone at a premiership club then.

I see what you're saying, like Tom I was a little disappointed we didn't keep Simeon Jackson on... Obviously not a world beater but showed a good work rate and managed a few goals too, ideal for cup comps and surely would't have demanded the earth in wages. Delfuenso's movement didn't give us enough of an outlet IMO, someone a bit smaller and a bit nippier would be more ideal.

I think it is a premiership club.

I thought Jackson should have be kept on.

[LDRover]

I think it is a perm club.

I thought Jackson should have be kept on.

Rudi Voller? Kevin Keegan?

[Dreams of 1995]

Then your argument is more along the lines of we can't give anyone significant funding unless they immediately prove to be an exceptional manager? Too much of a risk?

Fair dos. I disagree as any immediate impact top top quality managers aren't rolling up at Ewood but I see your point.

FWIW I think we've dying a slow death any way with the squad gradually getting weaker, the debt mounting and more fans drifting away. We're currently terminal but dying a slow death.

The only possible way Imo for us to get a good manager, give them a decent budget to address the squad's gaping weaknesses and get promoted. Appreciate far from guaranteed bit without that premiership money and a season of renewed interest from premiership we're dead. It is a risk but since we're dying anyway the chance it might work, however slim, must be grasped at.

Problem is we've idiot owners, a has been manager and no budget. Not a great start for seizing this slim chance.

I know it's a negative way of thinking but I just feel as if I'd rather camp and survive it out in the Championship and bide our time for the gamble on promotion. I do agree that it needs to come soon, attendances are down every year, discontent is growing and it will get to the point that fans simply won't come back. If the talk of Venky's waiting for promotion to sell is true I'd love nothing more than for it to be this year. But it won't. And I don't think it would have been if we had thrown money at Lambert either. I think it would have just been another huge disappointment.

That said, I am starting to agree with the sentiments of some: I do think I'd rather see us in League 2 without Venky's than in the Championship with Venky's. Sounds heartless to say but it's true. They are poison and I want them gone.

Onto the topic of Hanley, I am concerned by Coyle's praise of Wharton. I said previously he isn't ready and I stand by that. Got a pasting against Chelsea youth and will no doubt get a pasting a few times in this league. We will leak goals. You HAVE to replace Hanley if he goes with a suitable player, if not we will be looking at a dog fight this year and I don't think we have the firepower to escape it.

[JHRover]

If they aren't prepared or aren't able to 'gamble' any more money then they need to give up and sell to someone who can, because there's no chance in hell we'll ever get promoted by selling off our quality players every season and relying on loans and free transfers to plug the gaps. No club has gone up recently doing that. Even Blackpool spent a bit under Holloway when they went up.

A club that meant business and had ambition would have kept hold of Cairney and Rhodes, footed the expense of doing so, fought to keep Gestede (albeit he went up to the Premier League so fair enough) and would have reinvested money received into signing quality replacements. Of course the club couldn't afford to pay Rhodes' salary, yet that's where investors come in to make up the shortfall. Fulham can't afford McCormack's salary, Wednesday can't afford Fletcher's salary, but their owners can. Their fans aren't advocating 'self sustainability' - they want to compete and challenge and know the best way to do it is to spend.

I'm not suggesting putting the clubs future at risk or paying insane wages, but investment into the playing squad at a competitive level like Sheffield Wednesday have done these last 12 months.

Wolves are about to be taken over by a Chinese billionaire, who is presumably wanting to spend his own money to make Wolves a better side. I'm sure their fans won't be worrying about their financial structure if it gets them challenging for promotion next season.

It goes to show that there's no place in this division for owners who aren't interested, or are unwilling or unable to invest, and there is an ever growing appeal globally of buying into the Championship, where one good season delivers massive returns. If they just want to cut costs to save themselves money then the club will ultimately end up in League One and they will never get their money back. They have to gamble or give up and let someone else take over.

[tomphil]

I know it's a negative way of thinking but I just feel as if I'd rather camp and survive it out in the Championship and bide our time for the gamble on promotion. I do agree that it needs to come soon, attendances are down every year, discontent is growing and it will get to the point that fans simply won't come back. If the talk of Venky's waiting for promotion to sell is true I'd love nothing more than for it to be this year. But it won't. And I don't think it would have been if we had thrown money at Lambert either. I think it would have just been another huge disappointment.

That said, I am starting to agree with the sentiments of some: I do think I'd rather see us in League 2 without Venky's than in the Championship with Venky's. Sounds heartless to say but it's true. They are poison and I want them gone.

Onto the topic of Hanley, I am concerned by Coyle's praise of Wharton. I said previously he isn't ready and I stand by that. Got a pasting against Chelsea youth and will no doubt get a pasting a few times in this league. We will leak goals. You HAVE to replace Hanley if he goes with a suitable player, if not we will be looking at a dog fight this year and I don't think we have the firepower to escape it.

Think I misjudged you at first so apologises for that as with those sentiments I can tell your real

[unsall]

Keep on blowing up the venkys pipe ... Such a patronising post . Blah blah .

Please don't tell me what I can or cannot do ... Who the hell do you think you are .

. Are you still here?

[ABBEY]

edit really cant be arsed

[tomphil]

If they aren't prepared or aren't able to 'gamble' any more money then they need to give up and sell to someone who can, because there's no chance in hell we'll ever get promoted by selling off our quality players every season and relying on loans and free transfers to plug the gaps. No club has gone up recently doing that. Even Blackpool spent a bit under Holloway when they went up.

A club that meant business and had ambition would have kept hold of Cairney and Rhodes, footed the expense of doing so, fought to keep Gestede (albeit he went up to the Premier League so fair enough) and would have reinvested money received into signing quality replacements. Of course the club couldn't afford to pay Rhodes' salary, yet that's where investors come in to make up the shortfall. Fulham can't afford McCormack's salary, Wednesday can't afford Fletcher's salary, but their owners can. Their fans aren't advocating 'self sustainability' - they want to compete and challenge and know the best way to do it is to spend.

I'm not suggesting putting the clubs future at risk or paying insane wages, but investment into the playing squad at a competitive level like Sheffield Wednesday have done these last 12 months.

Wolves are about to be taken over by a Chinese billionaire, who is presumably wanting to spend his own money to make Wolves a better side. I'm sure their fans won't be worrying about their financial structure if it gets them challenging for promotion next season.

It goes to show that there's no place in this division for owners who aren't interested, or are unwilling or unable to invest, and there is an ever growing appeal globally of buying into the Championship, where one good season delivers massive returns. If they just want to cut costs to save themselves money then the club will ultimately end up in League One and they will never get their money back. They have to gamble or give up and let someone else take over.

In just think it adds weight to the suspicion we were just being run on debt with the BOI or someone. They seemed to hold on to players for a while then as soon as the parachutes (already borrowed against as the accs showed) were set to dry up the sales started.

With no real large guaranteed income on the horizon they'd want the debt paying down considerably in order to keep the ball rolling otherwise they'd be grabbing Indian assets. They might well want to walk away, they've certainly completely distanced themselves from it, but in a situation like that they can't.

Can't see anymore real signings now just loans.

[Speedie Dived]

Didn't know we were interested in one. Guessing it's someone at a prem club then.

I see what you're saying, like Tom I was a little disappointed we didn't keep Simeon Jackson on... Obviously not a world beater but showed a good work rate and managed a few goals too, ideal for cup comps and surely would't have demanded the earth in wages. Delfuenso's movement didn't give us enough of an outlet IMO, someone a bit smaller and a bit nippier would be more ideal.

Been offered a deal at Oxford

[Blue blood]

I know it's a negative way of thinking but I just feel as if I'd rather camp and survive it out in the Championship and bide our time for the gamble on promotion. I do agree that it needs to come soon, attendances are down every year, discontent is growing and it will get to the point that fans simply won't come back. If the talk of Venky's waiting for promotion to sell is true I'd love nothing more than for it to be this year. But it won't. And I don't think it would have been if we had thrown money at Lambert either. I think it would have just been another huge disappointment.

That said, I am starting to agree with the sentiments of some: I do think I'd rather see us in League 2 without Venky's than in the Championship with Venky's. Sounds heartless to say but it's true. They are poison and I want them gone.

Onto the topic of Hanley, I am concerned by Coyle's praise of Wharton. I said previously he isn't ready and I stand by that. Got a pasting against Chelsea youth and will no doubt get a pasting a few times in this league. We will leak goals. You HAVE to replace Hanley if he goes with a suitable player, if not we will be looking at a dog fight this year and I don't think we have the firepower to escape it.

Fair enough - though I'm not sure we will survive in the championship given the current set up. A year ago I'd say we were comfortably better than the likes of Rotherham and Preston. Now with the latter I'm not so sure. Stay still and we'll get overtaken (and I think we're going backwards.)

In an ideal world I agree new owners taking over a championship club would be better than taking over league 2 - less damage to undo but Luke you say probably takes league 2 to be rid of them.

Spot on about Hanley Imo too.

[chaddyrovers]

Couldnt we not spend when Cairney and Gestede were sold because we were in an embargo and the league wouldnt authorise or register the player transfer paperwork?

Also lets not forget that Gestede want out last summer just like Rhodes did.

JHRover, you are right that the owners should be backing Coyle with some money. Maybe they might back Coyle with money in January if we are mid table or even close to top 6.

[Amo]

Couldnt we not spend when Cairney and Gestede were sold because we were in an embargo and the league wouldnt authorise or register the player transfer paperwork?

Also lets not forget that Gestede want out last summer just like Rhodes did.

JHRover, you are right that the owners should be backing Coyle with some money. Maybe they might back Coyle with money in January if we are mid table or even close to top 6.

What's our excuse for spending jack @#/? this season?

I'll laugh my ass off if we're embargoed again without spending anything.

[tomphil]

What I don't understand is Cairney, Rudy were small investments that brought big returns. Marshall, Evans, Duffy the same and would all bring double plus to what was paid. These are the guys who were and will pay the bills so surely speculating a couple of million of their billions or what has been brought in will pay dividends in the long term plus helping the team of course.

The pot must be completely empty or there is something else afoot somewhere.

[Blue blood]

Couldnt we not spend when Cairney and Gestede were sold because we were in an embargo and the league wouldnt authorise or register the player transfer paperwork?

Also lets not forget that Gestede want out last summer just like Rhodes did.

JHRover, you are right that the owners should be backing Coyle with some money. Maybe they might back Coyle with money in January if we are mid table or even close to top 6.

I'll stop after this as it's beginning to wind me up but one last question - well two:

1) Have Venkys ever done anything wrong?

2) Why do you defend them/assume the best of them given their repeated poor actions throughout their entire time at the club?

[Dreams of 1995]

If they aren't prepared or aren't able to 'gamble' any more money then they need to give up and sell to someone who can, because there's no chance in hell we'll ever get promoted by selling off our quality players every season and relying on loans and free transfers to plug the gaps. No club has gone up recently doing that. Even Blackpool spent a bit under Holloway when they went up.

A club that meant business and had ambition would have kept hold of Cairney and Rhodes, footed the expense of doing so, fought to keep Gestede (albeit he went up to the Premier League so fair enough) and would have reinvested money received into signing quality replacements. Of course the club couldn't afford to pay Rhodes' salary, yet that's where investors come in to make up the shortfall. Fulham can't afford McCormack's salary, Wednesday can't afford Fletcher's salary, but their owners can. Their fans aren't advocating 'self sustainability' - they want to compete and challenge and know the best way to do it is to spend.

I'm not suggesting putting the clubs future at risk or paying insane wages, but investment into the playing squad at a competitive level like Sheffield Wednesday have done these last 12 months.

Wolves are about to be taken over by a Chinese billionaire, who is presumably wanting to spend his own money to make Wolves a better side. I'm sure their fans won't be worrying about their financial structure if it gets them challenging for promotion next season.

It goes to show that there's no place in this division for owners who aren't interested, or are unwilling or unable to invest, and there is an ever growing appeal globally of buying into the Championship, where one good season delivers massive returns. If they just want to cut costs to save themselves money then the club will ultimately end up in League One and they will never get their money back. They have to gamble or give up and let someone else take over.

I don't think they can sell. I think they have the debt tied up to their own personal assets (land in India I have heard although I am unsure) and in order for them to be able to sell this club they would need to write that debt off to themselves and pay the BOI. At the moment the club is worthless. I don't understand or know why they refused to speak to Seneca as a get out opportunity for them must have been something most would jump at. That decision stinks.

Think I misjudged you at first so apologises for that as with those sentiments I can tell your real

No problem.

Fair enough - though I'm not sure we will survive in the championship given the current set up. A year ago I'd say we were comfortably better than the likes of Rotherham and Preston. Now with the latter I'm not so sure. Stay still and we'll get overtaken (and I think we're going backwards.)

In an ideal world I agree new owners taking over a championship club would be better than taking over league 2 - less damage to undo but Luke you say probably takes league 2 to be rid of them.

Spot on about Hanley Imo too.

Definitely. I think we are still in a better position than 5 or 6 clubs in this league in terms of players. I also still think we have a very good pulling power in getting players here - the problem is that once they are here they are privvy to the goings on at the club and, inevitably, the players with ambition realise they need to go in order to achieve that. The all hands on deck and survive attitude here grinds on ambitious professionals.

[JHRover]

Simple fact is this. In the last 12 months we have received more money in player sales from Rhodes, Cairney, Gestede, King, Nzonzi and Olsson than any other club outside the Premier League. A conservative estimate puts monies received in the region of £20 million, and then there's the wages saved too.

Beyond that we've barely spent a penny on transfer fees. The club claimed to have paid money for Ward and Bennett but I'm not sure Norwich or Bournemouth would have asked for anything other than for us to agree pay the remaining 6 months on their contracts.

Nobody else has sold so much and yet spent so little.

If they have decided to use that money to plug losses and recoup some money then that's their choice, but if that's the plan of action it can only take place until all the assets are sold (not far off that point now) and is highly likely to ensure further decline on and off the pitch, unless the manager performs a minor miracle on a shoestring. Don't be insulting me with Premier League pledges and 'wanting promotion' nonsense.

Meanwhile the world keeps on turning and most other clubs are busy spending money, improving themselves, investing into their squads, tying players down to long term contracts. Business as usual elsewhere with clubs who have owners who aren't afraid to put their money on the table and fund continued losses even if promotion isn't achieved.

Other clubs are up to their eyeballs in debt and annual losses just like us, but have owners who keep on funding it to try and reap the rewards of promotion.

[tomphil]

Going off what we've seen so far of how they do things I wouldn't be surprised if they've created a huge financial mess on their own doorstep with owning Rovers. Probably being serviced by a % of the parachutes but now the whole mess will have to be suddenly got under control and cleaned up.

Hence why ex agency/new agency advisors might be running it again along with the finance people and the 3 stooges have all but disappeared. Other people clearing up the mess which might take years now along the lines of what we've seen since last summer. They won't pay it out of their own pockets nor give up their assets so on we go like this, just as the mess of the finances at the club was beginning to be sorted post Kean now the mess of what's been financing it all from the top needs squaring up !

We'll never get rid and anything like Seneca would just uncover all the mess and probably find their proposed investment would only be swallowed up by the debt.

[chaddyrovers]

What's our excuse for spending jack @#/? this season?

I'll laugh my ass off if we're embargoed again without spending anything.

I think we should be spending money this season. I would give Coyle 5 mil to spend this summer.

Would I have give Lambert the money he wants to reshape the squad and the promotion he wanted? Yes I would. But I would have suited all this out when the club appointed Lambert.

Also after Lambert left the owners should have done a statement on the website explaining why Lambert was leaving

After Coyle was appointed the club should have outlined the plan going forward under the manager and done an interview on the Rovers website.

I really don't understand why Cheston doesn't do an interview on the Rovers website to outline the plans going forward. The owners doesn't want to do interviews. The one thing I remember when John Henry and his group bought Liverpool they did Live TV interview and allowed fans to asked questions. We never do any of this

I'll stop after this as it's beginning to wind me up but one last question - well two:

1) Have Venkys ever done anything wrong?

2) Why do you defend them/assume the best of them given their repeated poor actions throughout their entire time at the club?

1. I have address these points many times. They have done wrong in their times. PM me I will give you them all

2. Nobody has defend these. All I have done is say we were in the embargo last summer and that we couldn't have done cash buys

[islander200]

Simple fact is this. In the last 12 months we have received more money in player sales from Rhodes, Cairney, Gestede, King, Nzonzi and Olsson than any other club outside the Premier League. A conservative estimate puts monies received in the region of £20 million, and then there's the wages saved too.

Beyond that we've barely spent a penny on transfer fees. The club claimed to have paid money for Ward and Bennett but I'm not sure Norwich or Bournemouth would have asked for anything other than for us to agree pay the remaining 6 months on their contracts.

Nobody else has sold so much and yet spent so little.

If they have decided to use that money to plug losses and recoup some money then that's their choice, but if that's the plan of action it can only take place until all the assets are sold (not far off that point now) and is highly likely to ensure further decline on and off the pitch, unless the manager performs a minor miracle on a shoestring. Don't be insulting me with Premier League pledges and 'wanting promotion' nonsense.

Meanwhile the world keeps on turning and most other clubs are busy spending money, improving themselves, investing into their squads, tying players down to long term contracts. Business as usual elsewhere with clubs who have owners who aren't afraid to put their money on the table and fund continued losses even if promotion isn't achieved.

Other clubs are up to their eyeballs in debt and annual losses just like us, but have owners who keep on funding it to try and reap the rewards of promotion.

Excellent post and agree with all but how much have we spent paying up contracts?It must be in to its many millions

[otto man]

It's not about the grass being greener mate. It's about being able to compartmentalise different topics on the same issue. Most of us accept and agree wholeheartedly with the opinions on Venkys. Others don't and that's their opinion...but why do people constantly bleat on and on about their gripes with Venkys when actually, this thread is the transfer thread?

It's like being in a staff meeting and having 10 things on the agenda and someone constantly referring back to the coffee machine being broken. There's a time and a place for everything and I for one am only interested in who we are signing and who we are not...hence why I review the transfer thread...

So when the haters are next on here banging on about the coffee machine, err Venkys, don't be surprised if the rest of us ignore you or worse rise to you.

The truth is we probably all feel the same. We just Cba listening to it every. Single. Day.

Top post. Well said sir!

[Glosrover]

Wolves are about to be taken over by a Chinese billionaire, who is presumably wanting to spend his own money to make Wolves a better side. I'm sure their fans won't be worrying about their financial structure if it gets them challenging for promotion next season.

within the controls of FFP of course, and we've seen how strictly the EFL apply those criteria.

Nothing relating to club ownership, borrowing, player sales/purchases and incidental expenses seems to make any sense whatsoever these days- when it all comes crashing down, I hope all the current crop of greedy club-owning egotists go to hell in a hand-cart part of me hopes it happens quickly!

[chaddyrovers]

From Sky Sports reporter Keith Downie on Twitter

Expecting Newcastle to go back in with another bid for Grant Hanley this week. Blackburn looking for £5.7m (rising to £6m) for the defender.

Coyle this morning said at the Q and A session that he is after a Goalkeeper, Left back and Pacey striker