Transfer Window - COMPLETE. Where’s Gregg?

[rigger]

46 minutes ago, tomphil said:

It would be great if he could slot in Van Heckes position now although i wouldn't expect him to be as good.  If he can defend though and has a bit of strength he should be ok.

I feel our luck will run out at some point getting in these quality defensive loanees.

I think Ash Phillips will turn out to be as good as Van Hecke. With Ayala, Lenihan, Wharton, Carter, Barnes and Phillips I don't think we have a need of central defensive loanees. 

[LeftWinger]

Cedric Kipre is available again, though I don't think he's had much game time over the last couple of years.

[roversfan99]

2 minutes ago, rigger said:

I think Ash Phillips will turn out to be as good as Van Hecke. With Ayala, Lenihan, Wharton, Carter, Barnes and Phillips I don't think we have a need of central defensive loanees. 

If Lenihan stays and the new manager plans to play a back 4 then you may be right, but we can't classify 2 total rookies as viable options at the moment. Maybe Barnes needs loaning out.

[Exiled_Rover]

11 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

If Lenihan stays and the new manager plans to play a back 4 then you may be right, but we can't classify 2 total rookies as viable options at the moment. Maybe Barnes needs loaning out.

Am I the only one that thinks Lenihan is bang average?

I wouldn't be straining myself to keep him - especially if we plan to play in a back 4 next year. 

[rigger]

8 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

If Lenihan stays and the new manager plans to play a back 4 then you may be right, but we can't classify 2 total rookies as viable options at the moment. Maybe Barnes needs loaning out.

I never said Barnes or Phillips would be starters. They would be cover on the bench for match injuries. We would still have four non-rookie center halves for either two or three positions. Personnally I would deem that enough.

[roversfan99]

8 minutes ago, Exiled_Rover said:

Am I the only one that thinks Lenihan is bang average?

I wouldn't be straining myself to keep him - especially if we plan to play in a back 4 next year. 

He definitely isn't perfect but he is a solid Championship defender and we would only get worse on a free/loan.

[Guest]

30 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

but we can't classify 2 total rookies as viable options at the moment

I don't know... Ash Phillips is widely regarded as the best young centre-back in the country at his age.

[roversfan99]

1 minute ago, JoeH said:

I don't know... Ash Phillips is widely regarded as the best young centre-back in the country at his age.

Big statement to make. Firstly, "widely regarded" by who? Where has this come from?

Also, he is playing with and against kids, its not directly comparable to senior football. Maybe he should go out and play a full season in League 2, I wouldn't feel comfortable putting someone so young in at this moment, as much as I am sure that he has talent, especially at centre back.

[bluebruce]

16 minutes ago, JoeH said:

I don't know... Ash Phillips is widely regarded as the best young centre-back in the country at his age.

But his age is 16.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

38 minutes ago, rigger said:

I never said Barnes or Phillips would be starters. They would be cover on the bench for match injuries. We would still have four non-rookie center halves for either two or three positions. Personnally I would deem that enough.

It’s not enough if we play with 3 at the back, especially if one of them is Ayala.

[Guest]

17 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Big statement to make. Firstly, "widely regarded" by who? Where has this come from?

It is a big statement but it's true. By scouts up and down the country.

[Guest]

18 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Also, he is playing with and against kids

That's how it works. If Phillips was a Man Utd player we'd be delighted to bring him in on loan. He's 6ft 3" tall, huge massive unit. Physicality will not be an issue.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

19 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Big statement to make. Firstly, "widely regarded" by who? Where has this come from?

Also, he is playing with and against kids, its not directly comparable to senior football. Maybe he should go out and play a full season in League 2, I wouldn't feel comfortable putting someone so young in at this moment, as much as I am sure that he has talent, especially at centre back.

He seems to get injured a lot.

[roversfan99]

27 minutes ago, JoeH said:

That's how it works. If Phillips was a Man Utd player we'd be delighted to bring him in on loan. He's 6ft 3" tall, huge massive unit. Physicality will not be an issue.

He is 16/17, he might be physically imposing for his age but again, that's the limitations of judging a kid playing with and against kids, its all relative and its a world away from the demands of second tier professional League football. I am sure that he is indeed highly rated (although you cannot possibly say THE best in the country in his position at that age even if you have consulted some fellow analysts/scouts) but maybe he would be better suited getting regular football out on loan next season.

You once suggested that there was no difference between Butterworth (I think, apologies if it was Rankin Costello) and Hudson-Odoi, and that there was no difference between Lewis Thompson and Brandon Williams but that it was a case of people having a perception that kids at bigger clubs are bound to be better as a result, which clearly is untrue. But you say that we would be delighted to bring in a Man United player on loan of a similar ilk, how many centre backs at Phillips' age have we brought in on loan, thats nonsense. You look at the centre backs that we have loaned in, a 21 year old with 40 appearances in the Dutch league and a 21 year old with 30 appearances in the Championship, no untested 16/17 year old centre backs.

 

Edited May 19, 2022 by roversfan99

[LeftWinger]

1 hour ago, Exiled_Rover said:

Am I the only one that thinks Lenihan is bang average?

I wouldn't be straining myself to keep him - especially if we plan to play in a back 4 next year. 

I'm not his biggest fan, but over the last four seasons he has failed to start in 33 games and we've only won 7 of them. 

We definitely do better when he plays.

[Mattyblue]

I’m never ‘delighted’ to bringing in teenagers on loan, as much of a chance as miss as hit, as we’ve seen in recent years.

Being a ‘big unit’ is only half the battle when it comes to being ready for centre half at a decent level; you also need decision making, composure, not giving away soft fouls to canny forwards, just general game nous, case in point - Branthwaite.

Now they will get that with game time obviously, but it’s unlikely a raw 18 year old on loan from a PL academy is going to accrue it in 6 months or so with us…

Edited May 19, 2022 by Mattyblue

[roversfan99]

It is a tough position to break through in that if you are a young attacking player, they can be dipped in through cameos at the end of games whereas as a centre back you are going to play the whole game.

We have been linked again with Harness at Portsmouth, no doubt rubbish seeing as we don't have a manager or director of football but I thought I would put it in here:

https://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/football/portsmouth-fc/portsmouth-transfer-gossip-blues-in-battle-with-derby-sunderland-and-hibs-for-hull-winger-as-blackburn-lead-marcus-harness-race-and-league-two-trio-show-kieron-freeman-interest-3698973

Edit: Just to prove its a load of nonsense, I think it came from this account. Imagine having enough spare time to create an account trying to generate attention by making up fake transfer news:

 

Edited May 19, 2022 by roversfan99

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

16 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

It is a tough position to break through in that if you are a young attacking player, they can be dipped in through cameos at the end of games whereas as a centre back you are going to play the whole game.

We have been linked again with Harness at Portsmouth, no doubt rubbish seeing as we don't have a manager or director of football but I thought I would put it in here:

https://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/football/portsmouth-fc/portsmouth-transfer-gossip-blues-in-battle-with-derby-sunderland-and-hibs-for-hull-winger-as-blackburn-lead-marcus-harness-race-and-league-two-trio-show-kieron-freeman-interest-3698973

Edit: Just to prove its a load of nonsense, I think it came from this account. Imagine having enough spare time to create an account trying to generate attention by making up fake transfer news:

 

Another one to add to our winger collection.

[Oldgregg86]

Never seen Phillips play so this judgment isn’t off ability but if he’s big and strong enough to compete in this league  and has the skill set then he’s old enough for the bench and should be on it imo. Wont be the first 17 year old to play championship level football. Why waste another wage and place on the bench if this kid is good enough as cover if nothing else. He’s just as likely to get injured playing down the leagues. Play him pre season and if he does well keep him for the first team squad 

[roversfan99]

1 hour ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

Another one to add to our winger collection.

As with basically every position, we could do with another wide player to be fair.

Hedges hopefully will play a much more important role and we also have Markanday both who seem to prefer playing from the right, on the left once Brereton leaves we only have Dolan who isn't good enough to be a regular so we need someone for that left hand side, assuming we play with wide players.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

he might be physically imposing for his age but

He’s not physically imposing “for his age”. He’s just physically imposing. There’s nothing about his game that would see him struggle in the first team. We’re not dealing with a usual youth graduate here. IMO we’re talking about a future England star.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Mattyblue said:

Being a ‘big unit’ is only half the battle when it comes to being ready for centre half at a decent level

He has it all.

[roversfan99]

2 minutes ago, JoeH said:

He’s not physically imposing “for his age”. He’s just physically imposing. There’s nothing about his game that would see him struggle in the first team. We’re not dealing with a usual youth graduate here. IMO we’re talking about a future England star.

Hes never faced senior strikers though, you cant possibly know at this stage whether he is physical enough to deal with proper men nor if he is clever enough, yet anyway.

[tomphil]

There's a lot of expectation building on this lad already.

I'd rather see him go quietly on loan somewhere for 6 months getting games then see how it goes.

People get carried away too easily similar things were said about Lowe, Henley was highly rated when young.  And of course for those who remember Marlon Broomes was the next big thing for a long time.

Lets give him time to develop.

[Mattyblue]

11 minutes ago, JoeH said:

He has it all.

I was more talking about loans of teenagers from other clubs, I don’t get excited just because they are big lads from big clubs.

I am very excited about him, but let’s not get carried away, wonder kids have often not kicked on, but of course he may well do so, but either way he will obviously be eased in over the next couple of years, he’s not going to be starting Championship games on a regular basis next season.