[Archived] Charlton V Blackburn

[SAS]

oh no its the end of the world

were we really that bad

its like reading peoples last words impending an apocolypse

[92er]

every cloud.... FLB.

the benni and nonda partnership is not working. it seems obvious to me that both players need a pacey partner to bring out the best in them.

My friend and I wonder if this will also apply to Roberts. He had a very good season with Wigan but we woner if that was aided by Camara's pace. We fear we have bought the WBA Roberts.

[Tris]

OK I'm going to have to take some of the blame for last nights defeat.

Earlier in the season I bought the new home shirt, and have so far worn it to the following games:

Salzburg H - Won 2-0

Wigan H - Won 2-1

Krakow A - Won 2-1

Basel H - Won 3-0

Feyenoord A - Draw 0-0

Fulham H - Won 2-0

The games I've been to not wearing the new shirt:

Chelsea H - Lost 2-0

West Ham A - Lost 2-1

Aston Villa A - Lost 2-0

Charlton A - Lost 1-0

Can't make Newcastle, but get a couple of quid on us beating Nancy a week today.

:ph34r:

[pleasure]

My friend and I wonder if this will also apply to Roberts. He had a very good season with Wigan but we woner if that was aided by Camara's pace. We fear we have bought the WBA Roberts.

yes his finishing was poor, but i dont think roberts displays were as bad as they've been made out to be.

IMO both nonda and benni would perform better with roberts/ jeffers as a partner, than they have with each other.

[CAPT KAYOS]

But i really dont know who we can bring from the bench that will improve the first eleven significantly.

Improve in apparent ability maybe not ys but might see a difference in performance and application.

Would also get the apparently better players thinking.... we would hope anyway

Edited December 6, 2006 by CAPT KAYOS

[frosty]

I would of shown Nonda the door last night and sent him back to Roma

I'd love to know how somebody like him ended up at one of Europe's biggestclubs?!

[tcj_jones]

I can agree with most of the rant SS, but not this bit. Henchoz is a good player, becuase what he lacks up for in pace he usually makes up for in his ability to read the game and anticipate what is coming - very similar to Mr Nelsen.

I have to agree Stu. Henchoz is a superb defender. The only limitation to his game is his speed, but last night he was rarely beaten by Bent because of his ability to put in a great saving tackle and to otherwise read the game exceptionally well. But does anybody else think he looks slightly peculiar when he runs?

One of our problems I think is that we don't have enough defensively-minded players in the team when we play away. The likes of Bentley, Pedersen, Tugay, Gallagher, Peter and Gray are all better going forward and all lack defensive responsibility at times. If you add that to the fact that our front two don't work hard enough when the opposition are in posession then it means we are bound to come under pressure away from home.

I think this is a good point, and what is all the more worrying is that we don't seem to be able to create anywhere near enough chances.

As for suggestions that we play 4-5-1, well I don't think that any of our strikers have the ability to hold the ball up or win it in the air for this to be successful. Of our attackers displays this season, you'd probably have to start with McCarthy, but he plays far too deep at times to play on his own. Nonda has been appauling, Roberts is injured and Jeffers could never play on his own up front. 4-5-1 would see us score even less, but hey, it might make us harder to beat.

Personally, I'd stick with the 4-4-2 and put Sergio Peter on the left until january. He is hungry and enthusiastic with some good skill and pace and a great cross. Then in January, I'd buy or loan a quality midfielder to cover Reid's absence and a striker of real pedigree that can hold the ball up well enough to be played on his own.

I really wish that we'd have got Mido in the summer.

[gazsimm]

I'd love to know how somebody like him ended up at one of Europe's biggestclubs?!

I rather have Kuqi then him, ok he is not the greatest CF you could meet, but at least he gave 100% unlike lazy sod Nonda

[RevidgeBlue]

Imo we are now seeing the effect of the sustained lack of investment in the side since Hughes took over at Ewood.

Since he's been at the Club I think he's spent a net 995,000, that was before we somehow managed to offload Kuqi for 2.5m.

We've only signed three bluechip PROVEN Premiership performers Two, Savage and Bellamy, have been roaring successes. The third Roberts hasn't been great but it's too early to say as he's been blighted by injury. I think it was Den who made the point some time ago that we're signing too many gambles

McCarthy 28 - no Premiership experience

Nonda similar age - no Premiership experience, serious knee injury

Ooijer 32 - no Premiership experience

Jeffers - another who's had a serious injury - career shipwrecked a long time ago - waste of a wage and squad place imo.

Henchoz 32 - offloaded by Wigan and at the end of his career

Now we're on about signing Okkas, yet another player at 29 entering the final phase of his career with no previous Premiership experience. OK - he might turn out to be ok but you wouldn't want to stake our Premiership lives on it.

We face a very tricky dilemma in January imo. Do we just go for a couple of judicious loan signings and hope that they along with the returning Reid, Nelsen and Roberts (if they return in time) are enough to keep us up?

Or do we splash some serious cash on proven talent to try and ensure our extra 10m p.a. as from next season? Will there be anyone decent available at this stage of the season?

Not really a situation we should have got our selves in but one that has been several years in the making. Since Duff left we've got by for quite a while by periodically flogging off the crown jewels and reinvesting part of the proceeds but we've got to the stage now where only three or four of our players have any significant resale value and two of those are currently injured.

So either now, or at worst in the summer, the Trustees are finally going to have to provide the manager with some decent funding which doesn't involve flogging someone else off first if they want us to have a realistic chance of retaining our Premiership status in the short to medium term.

Edited December 6, 2006 by RevidgeBlue

[Presty On Tour]

Imo we are now seeing the effect of the sustained lack of investment in the side since Hughes took over at Ewood.

Since he's been at the Club I think he's spent a net 995,000, that was before we somehow managed to offload Kuqi for 2.5m.

We've only signed three bluechip PROVEN Premiership performers Two, Savage and Bellamy, have been roaring successes. The third Roberts hasn't been great but it's too early to say as he's been blighted by injury. I think it was Den who made the point some time ago that we're signing too many gambles

McCarthy 28 - no Premiership experience

Nonda similar age - no Premiership experience, serious knee injury

Ooijer 32 - no Premiership experience

Jeffers - another who's had a serious injury - career shipwrecked a long time ago - waste of a wage and squad place imo.

Henchoz 32 - offloaded by Wigan and at the end of his career

Now we're on about signing Okkas, yet another player at 29 entering the final phase of his career with no previous Premiership experience. OK - he might turn out to be ok but you wouldn't want to stake our Premiership lives on it.

We face a very tricky dilemma in January imo. Do we just go for a couple of judicious loan signings and hope that they along with the returning Reid, Nelsen and Roberts (if they return in time) are enough to keep us up?

Or do we splash some serious cash on proven talent to try and ensure our extra 10m p.a. as from next season? Will there be anyone decent available at this stage of the season?

Not really a situation we should have got our selves in but one that has been several years in the making. Since Duff left we've got by for quite a while by periodically flogging off the crown jewels and reinvesting part of the proceeds but we've got to the stage now where only three or four of our players have any significant resale value and two of those are currently injured.

So either now, or at worst in the summer, the Trustees are finally going to have to provide the manager with some decent funding which doesn't involve flogging someone else off first if they want us to have a realistic chance of retaining our Premiership status in the short to medium term.

a very honest point RevidgeBlue.

i think losing bellamy/nelsen/reidy to either injuries or being sold is more of a concern to a club like ours rather then a big squad with strength and depth.

when hughes has spent big i.e. bellamy, benni, savage, they have all provided the goods.

unlucky with the injury to roberts but you can't blame that on hughes.

something has to be done, imo it has to be done fast as it's sink or swim time.

[modes98]

OK I'm going to have to take some of the blame for last nights defeat.

Earlier in the season I bought the new home shirt, and have so far worn it to the following games:

On that note it might me slightly my fault as well. Not only did i miss the first half because i was playing footy but i then went and put my away shirt on! Charlton Colours, damn

[RevidgeBlue]

when hughes has spent big i.e. bellamy, benni, savage, they have all provided the goods.

I would say the jury is still very much out on McCarthy, good at the start of the season but since the temperature's dropped a few degrees he can't seem to be bothered enough to watch the line and stay onside let alone put in an honest 90 minutes shift.

In our current position if we're bringing anyone in in January we really need proven performers in this League. If we must gamble I'd rather we did it on hungry up and coming youngsters than more players at the wrong end of their careers who know that even if things go wrong at least they've had one last big pay day.

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

Rev - though I agree with your sentiment - is not every player purchase a gamble. I could list a whole host of players that looked good on paper and at their previous clubs (Kevin Davies coming top of the pile) - that ended up being less than successful at Rovers.

Looking at your list :-

McCarthy 28 - no Premiership experience - but Champs League winner and previously highly sought after player

Nonda similar age - only on loan

Ooijer 32 - World Cup player - who has been one of our better players recently

Jeffers - I think the jury is out - but i would allow Sparky one pet project - and age is on his side

Henchoz 32 - don't think he would have brought in if Nelsen hadn't got injured.

I agree we need serious investment - but even then we would probably be gambling on foreign players - just hopefully a better class and younger. Or would you prefer to buy Nugent for £4m ?

From the clubs perspective it is difficult - they are doing more than any club in the premiership to make football affordable - and yet the gates are only just holding their own. Against this back drop - all us fans will ask the club to spend between £5 - 10m (which I think is the minimum investment we need at xmas). Its all a gamble - with Rovers Premiership position at stake (believe me if relegated I can't see us coming straight back up) - boy could we do with another Jack

[RevidgeBlue]

I agree we need serious investment - but even then we would probably be gambling on foreign players - just hopefully a better class and younger. Or would you prefer to buy Nugent for £4m ?

I can't really see us spending that sort of money in January. I suspect the Board will make their usual cheery xmas announcement that there is no money for the manager to spend in January and we will try and muddle through with a loan signing or two and a bit of wheeling and dealing. i.e. a Dunn for todd type deal

However if we did I think that sort of signing would be money far better spent than drafting in another foreigner with no previous Premiership experience. At least a player like Nugent has an idea of the physical side and the pace of the game in England.

Edited December 6, 2006 by RevidgeBlue

[CAPT KAYOS]

I can't really see us spending that sort of money in January. I suspect the Board will make their usual cheery xmas announcement that there is no money for the manager to spend in January and we will try and muddle through with a loan signing or two and a bit of wheeling and dealing. i.e. a Dunn for todd type deal

However if we did I think that sort of signing would be money far better spent than drafting in another foreigner with no previous Premiership experience.

Good points Rev and if the situation is as such no funds are available, then alternatively ( which I think a few would advocate) is the issue of Faith being put into youngsters coming through. If we find ourselves in such a situation and cannot give rise to this faith then questions need to be answered re the benefits of the academy and the relevant people responsible for bringing them through the ranks - why are they not considered good enough, what is going on etc?

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

Many are calling for change,lets look at the present alternatives:

McCarthy or Jeffers?

Gallagher for Nonda?

Pedersen or Peter?

GREAT ISN'T IT.......AND YOU WONDER WHY WE ARE IN THE SH1T?

Not enough quality,not enough squad strength in depth.Get the purse strings loosened come January Rovers or face the dire consequences.

Edited December 6, 2006 by SIMON GARNERS 194

[stuwilky]

Are we going to have to put you back on suicide watch SG?

[USABlue]

For me the most annoying thing about McCarthy is the amount of times he gets caught offside. Does the guy not know the rules ffs? It takes me back to Egil Offsidestad.

I was thinking Andy Cole

[RevidgeBlue]

Good points Rev and if the situation is as such no funds are available, then alternatively ( which I think a few would advocate) is the issue of Faith being put into youngsters coming through. If we find ourselves in such a situation and cannot give rise to this faith then questions need to be answered re the benefits of the academy and the relevant people responsible for bringing them through the ranks - why are they not considered good enough, what is going on etc?

That was the next point I was going to make but it's taking the thread even further off topic. :ph34r:

What's going on at the Academy? If we had a steady stream of youngsters coming through we wouldn't need to worry so much about finding big transfer fees.

All our successful players Duff, Dunn, Beattie, Given, then to a lesser extent Martin Taylor and Damien Johnson all seemed to come through at around the same time many moons ago.

That's something else we need to look closely at. The Academy should be the lifeblood of the Club and fans feel more connected to players who have come through the ranks. At the moment however it's costing us 2-3m p.a. and we don't seem to have got any return at all for four of five seasons now.

[USABlue]

Losing to the bottom team says it all. This squad is in trouble and the board needs to back Hughes with some serious money in January.

Mmm, must have been the reaction at Old Trafford when Southend done 'em

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

I fear I'm not far of the mark Stuwilky,too many Rovers fans still back in the Dam on their European jolleys!

Edited December 6, 2006 by SIMON GARNERS 194

[USABlue]

That was the next point I was going to make but it's taking the thread even further off topic. :ph34r:

What's going on at the Academy? If we had a steady stream of youngsters coming through we wouldn't need to worry so much about finding big transfer fees.

All our successful players Duff, Dunn, Beattie, Given, then to a lesser extent Martin Taylor and Damien Johnson all seemed to come through at around the same time many moons ago.

That's something else we need to look closely at. The Academy should be the lifeblood of the Club and fans feel more connected to players who have come through the ranks. At the moment however it's costing us 2-3m p.a. and we don't seem to have got any return at all for four of five seasons now.

Must agree, for all the successes our youth has at it's own level, precious little seems to be coming through to make a serious fist of first team premiership footy.

[des]

Must agree, for all the successes our youth has at it's own level, precious little seems to be coming through to make a serious fist of first team premiership footy.

in order for the club of our limited money, one or two of the youth side of the club as to develop into first team players, of which todate most of them have not.

however we must take the season as a whole, and we have been a mixed team todate. At time we are good at time very bad. The outcome of this is that while I do not think we will go down we will be in the botton end of the table.

That could change if we spend well in jan. However so far. most of the spending is done at the start of the season, so heres hoping that, that is not the case.

Edited December 6, 2006 by des

[USABlue]

However if we did I think that sort of signing would be money far better spent than drafting in another foreigner with no previous Premiership experience. At least a player like Nugent has an idea of the physical side and the pace of the game in England.

So tell me again how many unproven premiership players have Chelsea, Man U Arsenal etc etc bought. Would we have all been elated at the beginning of the season if Rovers anouced they would gamble with Bankruptcy to buy Mescherwotsit, Tevez and Schevcenko? Mmmm. World Class players that have struggled to adjust. Ooyah is looking the part now, Benni is doing ok goals wise, Nonda lazy git. It's really a crap shoot unless you buy English Premiership players and even then things don't always work out.

Mark Hughes, how long was he in charge of Wales before they started to slide.

[yorkblues]

and this is why roma don't want nonda