[Archived] Rhodes- exit clause in contract

[G Somerset Rover]

See that is a tough question. However, we could go out and spend £2 million apiece on 4 players but combined I'd be surprised if they get 25+ goals between them.

Also, who is scouting these players and judging that they'd help us kick on up the league? Shebby? JA? Balaji?

Until Venkys clear off (probably never) I'm more than happy to keep Rhodes as the result without him would be nailed on relegation to league one.

[Guest Norbert]

I'd do my damnedest to clear out the crap like Murphy, Orr, Etuhu, the Portugeezers etc. before flogging Rhodes and trying to sign a couple of loans/Bosmans. Of course, we'd have have someone to sell them too, but if we can clear them off the wage bill that would be a good start.

If we sold Rhodes, you all know fate will deal us a blow if we did sell. He'd go, and all the deadwood would stay.

[LDRover]

It's beyond ridiculous to argue that we needed an 8 million pound striker to prevent us being relegated to the THIRD tier of English football.

Not knocking Rhodes but the money should have strengthened the whole team. Who we'd have bought is an unknown we can't argue given the idiots that run us, but doing this would've equipped us for promotion rather than relegation.

The teams fighting it out at the business end of the league and the respective cost of their squads proves that.

[den]

See that is a tough question.

It is.

The total money laid out for the Rhodes signing is probably in the region of £16m. (Including wages at £30k/week over a 5 year contract). IMO, at some point soon, we will have to sell him. If we use that money wisely, we can be a better team.

[Steve Kean's Hypnotoad]

It's beyond ridiculous to argue that we needed an 8 million pound striker to prevent us being relegated to the THIRD tier of English football.

Not knocking Rhodes but the money should have strengthened the whole team. Who we'd have bought is an unknown we can't argue given the idiots that run us, but doing this would've equipped us for promotion rather than relegation.

The teams fighting it out at the business end of the league and the respective cost of their squads proves that.

You keep ignoring other factors. We've had 2 of the worst managers to have ever plied their trade in the Championship. Our other 3 have been Steve Kean and 2 caretakers. Our biggest wage earner and biggest influence in the dressing room Danny Murphy has been a disgrace to all professional footballers. Our board have been at each others throats all season. Our coaching staff have all changed at least once. Our home atmosphere has become a disgruntled, occasionally furious, place of doom.

There are numerous reasons why we'd have got nowhere near promotion no matter what you spent that £8m on. There are about 4-5 huge factors that say we should have got relegated this season, buying Jordan Rhodes is either a very minor one, or isn't one at all. This is a case of not seeing the wood for the trees.

[Majiball]

Lets see how Rhodes gets on with a real manager if we ever get one or one who can aid his development. We've had Bury's reject, Dew boy, Gruffi Gummi and Mr Black, the main men have been jokers so far this season, in out shake it all about and change every 10 games. He needs stability and the same voice.

I wouldn't sell Rhodes unless he handed in a request, he will score goals and with good coaching and some stability he could become rather good.

Yes we could sell him and may need to, but other for me would go first (or try too) and JR would be may last resort. You see we could buy 3-4 players, but given our signings to date? I wouldn't be confident they'd work out.

How many portugesers could we get for 6M, sorry 4M, agents need their christmas presents.

I'd keep JR, unless he wanted out, he'll score goals and we'll need them, focus should be on the defence and midfield. If we need to sell him for finacial reasons then I'd say this, the aim isn't promotion.

It is.

The total money laid out for the Rhodes signing is probably in the region of £16m. (Including wages at £30k/week over a 5 year contract). IMO, at some point soon, we will have to sell him. If we use that money wisely, we can be a better team.

And that's the issue, we've never spent wisely under the Roa's.

[JBiz]

Get the real masterclass giving striker JR back on a free.... (Jason.....)

[den]

Always respect your input Maj, but you don'say how we can move forward as a team, assuming we keep Rhodes and there's no other money available.

[Jimmy612]

Always respect your input Maj, but you don'say how we can move forward as a team, assuming we keep Rhodes and there's no other money available.

I would say that's the crux of it, and similar to what I asked Rev yesterday. Assuming the Rao's have pulled the purse strings - which given the tosh that they have paid for in the last 3 years (particularly last summer) is not unreasonable to assume, then it may well be a case of sell to buy.

Question for everyone - WHAM come in with £6m bid for Rhodes - What does everyone do? Keep him and hope we can build a side to challenge with shrewd loans and freebies - Or take the £6m plus £35,000 p/w and try to build a solid, championship side capable of challenging.

My philosophy in football, first and foremost - build a solid spine through the team. Do we have that now? Could we build one with £0? Is Rhodes capable of being the top of that spine (4-4-2 is no longer an option in modern football IMO). Could we build that solid spine with a well spent £6m?

If, and its a bloody big IF - we could all be confident of the selection/transfer policy at Rovers - I would take the £6m and sign 4 - 5 players and build a solid outfit. After all, what use is a Porsche when you're driving on quicksand?

[Majiball]

Always respect your input Maj, but you don'say how we can move forward as a team, assuming we keep Rhodes and there's no other money available.

The only way we can move forward is if they stump up more money, selling JR if that happens won't be to strengthen it will be to cover costs. Even 6M will only last 3 months at the rumored rate, if he's sold that will be the reason and others will also follow. If that occurs we're still in 'transition' and I don't think we'll move forward next year. We'll need to be very good in the market to get the quality we need and to date we've failed miserably at that.

I still hope the morons will stump up the cash to put right their wrongs (wishful thinking)

I agree his all round game isn't the best but in the same vein, he's been being managed by clearly sub-standard managers/coaches so far. Maybe Bowyer and Mcphilips can enhance his all round game???

If promotion is the aim JR will stay and we'll have funds, if he's sold welcome to the wilderness and I don't think we will move forward.

Can I ask a Q of those who saw the last game? Did Givet do like Hanley and punt it aimlessly forward all the time? I only listened on the radio but from what I heard we played a bit more?

The only way we'll get JR to work as a lone man is if he's not the out ball, we'll need to play more and build it up to getting it too Rhodes. Something I thought it sounded like we did on Tuesday?

[T4E]

My main point is that the signing of Rhodes can only be deemed successful if we get promoted or if we sell on for a profit.

It's my firm opinion that neither will happen but I'd love to be proved wrong. Especially in the first instance.

Or if we probably would have got relegated without him?

[LDRover]

FFS, when we signed Rhodes did anyone say to themselves 'well that'll keep us up this season'?

I take into account poor owners, managers, Danny Fecking Murphy etc. but with that 8 million invested throughout the team wisely (I know that's almost impossible under this regime) we'd have stood a hell of a better chance at the top end rather than the bottom end.

I'm not sticking the boot into Rhodes here, his goals have undoubtedly kept us up but that's not the point here. He was bought to get us promoted, it's not going to happen, peobably not next year either. Will he want to stay at a club in the Championship? Doubtful. Will a Prem club pay more than what we did? IMO , doubtful again. So on that basis I can't see how we got value for money.

One final thing, if the popular view is that he is the POTY (a point that I agree with) why no posts lauding Shebby Singh for his role in the transfer. Seems he was the driving force behind it.

[ABBEY]

Why is everyone discussing this like we are a normal football club that makes normal , sensible decisions ?

[Steve Kean's Hypnotoad]

FFS, when we signed Rhodes did anyone say to themselves 'well that'll keep us up this season'?

I take into account poor owners, managers, Danny Fecking Murphy etc. but with that 8 million invested throughout the team wisely (I know that's almost impossible under this regime) we'd have stood a hell of a better chance at the top end rather than the bottom end.

I'm not sticking the boot into Rhodes here, his goals have undoubtedly kept us up but that's not the point here. He was bought to get us promoted, it's not going to happen, peobably not next year either. Will he want to stay at a club in the Championship? Doubtful. Will a Prem club pay more than what we did? IMO , doubtful again. So on that basis I can't see how we got value for money.

One final thing, if the popular view is that he is the POTY (a point that I agree with) why no posts lauding Shebby Singh for his role in the transfer. Seems he was the driving force behind it.

FFS indeed. Not many clubs in the world could sign a striker who becomes their highest scorer in 17 years in his first season, and then have half the fans complain about him being here. No wonder many neutrals think we have one of the most spoilt and hard to please fanbases going.

[Amo]

Lol. Well I guess to join in the debate of how the teams performances have worked out, the least you need to have done is watched them. 25 goals -yes, he' done more than could be expected of him, but that's a given, we all know that but isn't related to the point being made, not just by me, but by quite a few other fans - including might I add, the respected Parsonblue in his latest match report. Two facts here as far as I'm concerned. Firstly Rhodes has done very, very well. Secondly, as a team, we're completely toothless.

If we fail to control games, that's a midfield issue, not a striker one. When we were hoofing aimless 60 yard punts for Rhodes to win on his own with no support, whose fault is that? On more than one occasion you have argued that Rhodes doesn't have the qualities of a top-striker. His goals would suggest otherwise - and that's with little service all season. Off the ball movement, technique, predatory instincts, those are all qualities you need in a good striker.

Now, if you're arguing that the money might have been better spread across the whole team, that's a fairer point. Although, on paper the likes of Murphy, Etuhu & CKR should've been enough to get us within the playoffs. I'm still not following how that makes Rhodes a "problem", however. It's not his fault we paid as much as we did for him, and he's done everything we've expected of him. Not saying he's the complete forward or doesn't have his drawbacks but it seems very obtuse to make our high-scoring striker a scapegoat for our dismal performances.

[Majiball]

Rhodes lack of ability to play as a targetman as Den says is an issue when that's how we want to play. He isn't a brute, he doesn't strike me as aggresive and he's best with it being played to feet. So Den's right as if he can't play that way and that's how we want to play then it's an issue. The ball will keep coming back as was highly evident against Ipswich despite the result and goal. For that style goals only are not enough. But one the flipside the others are right as well in that we've needed his goals this season badly. It's a bit of a catch 22 and one of those you have to weigh up really, drop him for better team-play and lose his goals or change the style? I think Appleton's style wasn't at all suited to Rhodes and he showed no signs of changing developing that, christ he was playing CM's on RW??? Berg, well he made Kean look good, says it all.

I'd like to see us play 4231 with Rhodes at the top and the out ball being the 3 not the 1, but that will require pace in the 3 and for the back 4 and midfield 2 to be mobile and calm in possesion. We are too quick to punt it forward and too compact to expand to play as Appleton set us up. The whole barely covered half a pitch, so it's tight and passing football is tricky. What we need to have is better transition between defending and attacking and players to attack space the second we get possesion back. Bowyer seems to have us playing abit more like this so I'm keen to see where it leads. Next year provided we're not flogging all and sundry and re-using teabags to save pennies I'd like to see this team next year:

Kean

Henley Dann Givet Another

Williamson Another

King Rochina Olsson MKI

Rhodes

I honestly don't think we need that many new players, Hanley backs up CB and O'connell and Edwards as back-up. We need a LB, we haven't had for years, since Warnock as Olsson a winger all day for me. RB you could maybe loan Kane again and shift Henley over, but he's right footed and I like balance in the team foot wise for crossing etc. Williamson sitting alongside another who can play a bit, hence no lowe. Lowe though backs-up RB and CM so that's a bonus. Rochina I rate him and would like to see if we can develop him under someone who actually knows what they're talking about as he's yet to have that at Rovers, he also has that bit of magic and we'll need that. Kings alright and sounded decent against Huddersfield and as long as you bark at him he'll track back. Olsson MKI will do that anyway but he adds in a left foot and pace and when he's played LW he's set-up a few. As long as we have funds and a decent voice leading the lads I honestly think we'd have a chance with that team. Best can back-up Rhodes with Goodwillie Olsson MKII his twins back-up, although I'd want a new player to back-up / push Rochina. Everyone else can leave as loans can cover the injuries in this league with the windows open as they are.

[LeChuck]

Agree with your assessment Maji although I'd go for a slightly different shape. I guess my change is sacrificing an attacking midfielder to give the wide players more roaming freedom.

................... Kean

Henley .. Dann ... Givet ... Olsson

................ Williamson

.......... Lowe .......... Jones

. Rochina ........................ King

.................. Rhodes

Rochina and King can drift inside and support Rhodes (and will naturally do this given their favoured feet) but will have to get back out wide to defend against attacking fullbacks. Our own full backs push on when they do drift inside to retain width.

Williamson just screens the back four and is prepared to cover an attacking full back where necessary. Two midfielders with good engines to get up and down both ends. No room for the likes of Dunn in this formation really, at least not for 90 minutes.

Obviously that exact personnel isn't right or we'd not be stuck near the bottom of the league, but the general attributes are there.

[Lathund]

Agree with your assessment Maji although I'd go for a slightly different shape. I guess my change is sacrificing an attacking midfielder to give the wide players more roaming freedom.

................... Kean

Henley .. Dann ... Givet ... Olsson

................ Williamson

.......... Lowe .......... Jones

. Rochina ........................ King

.................. Rhodes

Rochina and King can drift inside and support Rhodes (and will naturally do this given their favoured feet) but will have to get back out wide to defend against attacking fullbacks. Our own full backs push on when they do drift inside to retain width.

Williamson just screens the back four and is prepared to cover an attacking full back where necessary. Two midfielders with good engines to get up and down both ends. No room for the likes of Dunn in this formation really, at least not for 90 minutes.

Obviously that exact personnel isn't right or we'd not be stuck near the bottom of the league, but the general attributes are there.

Pretty much the same way Id like to see us play as well. Its imho the best way to be able to utilize Rhodes while still enabling us to play 3 central midfielders.

[LDRover]

FFS indeed. Not many clubs in the world could sign a striker who becomes their highest scorer in 17 years in his first season, and then have half the fans complain about him being here. No wonder many neutrals think we have one of the most spoilt and hard to please fanbases going.

Blimey SKH, my point is value for money and would we have been better with the same amount spent right through it. I'm hardly moaning about him being here, my last post says he's my player of the year!!!

[ABBEY]

How many goals would the people slagging him expect him to score ? It's not his fault he been lumped to and hardly any service . He's done more than enough in this seasons awfulness . Look at murphy , etuhuhuhuhuhuuuuu and Orr for crapness but Christ almighty he has been the only shining light this season apart from Dunn keeping the steak going . People say I'm negative but by Christ this board at times is like brockhall of old.

[LDRover]

Rhodes lack of ability to play as a targetman as Den says is an issue when that's how we want to play. He isn't a brute, he doesn't strike me as aggresive and he's best with it being played to feet. So Den's right as if he can't play that way and that's how we want to play then it's an issue. The ball will keep coming back as was highly evident against Ipswich despite the result and goal. For that style goals only are not enough. But one the flipside the others are right as well in that we've needed his goals this season badly. It's a bit of a catch 22 and one of those you have to weigh up really, drop him for better team-play and lose his goals or change the style? I think Appleton's style wasn't at all suited to Rhodes and he showed no signs of changing developing that, christ he was playing CM's on RW??? Berg, well he made Kean look good, says it all.

I'd like to see us play 4231 with Rhodes at the top and the out ball being the 3 not the 1, but that will require pace in the 3 and for the back 4 and midfield 2 to be mobile and calm in possesion. We are too quick to punt it forward and too compact to expand to play as Appleton set us up. The whole barely covered half a pitch, so it's tight and passing football is tricky. What we need to have is better transition between defending and attacking and players to attack space the second we get possesion back. Bowyer seems to have us playing abit more like this so I'm keen to see where it leads. Next year provided we're not flogging all and sundry and re-using teabags to save pennies I'd like to see this team next year:

Kean

Henley Dann Givet Another

Williamson Another

King Rochina Olsson MKI

Rhodes

I honestly don't think we need that many new players, Hanley backs up CB and O'connell and Edwards as back-up. We need a LB, we haven't had for years, since Warnock as Olsson a winger all day for me. RB you could maybe loan Kane again and shift Henley over, but he's right footed and I like balance in the team foot wise for crossing etc. Williamson sitting alongside another who can play a bit, hence no lowe. Lowe though backs-up RB and CM so that's a bonus. Rochina I rate him and would like to see if we can develop him under someone who actually knows what they're talking about as he's yet to have that at Rovers, he also has that bit of magic and we'll need that. Kings alright and sounded decent against Huddersfield and as long as you bark at him he'll track back. Olsson MKI will do that anyway but he adds in a left foot and pace and when he's played LW he's set-up a few. As long as we have funds and a decent voice leading the lads I honestly think we'd have a chance with that team. Best can back-up Rhodes with Goodwillie Olsson MKII his twins back-up, although I'd want a new player to back-up / push Rochina. Everyone else can leave as loans can cover the injuries in this league with the windows open as they are.

Agreed Maj. For me the position alongside Williamson and 'the voice' you talk about should be Shaun Derry. Hard as nails, been successful in this division before and a leader.

It's imperative we get Kane for at least next season, he's a real prospect, if this means Henley at left back, I'd go with that.

[Majiball]

Agree with your assessment Maji although I'd go for a slightly different shape. I guess my change is sacrificing an attacking midfielder to give the wide players more roaming freedom.

................... Kean

Henley .. Dann ... Givet ... Olsson

................ Williamson

.......... Lowe .......... Jones

. Rochina ........................ King

.................. Rhodes

Rochina and King can drift inside and support Rhodes (and will naturally do this given their favoured feet) but will have to get back out wide to defend against attacking fullbacks. Our own full backs push on when they do drift inside to retain width.

Williamson just screens the back four and is prepared to cover an attacking full back where necessary. Two midfielders with good engines to get up and down both ends. No room for the likes of Dunn in this formation really, at least not for 90 minutes.

Obviously that exact personnel isn't right or we'd not be stuck near the bottom of the league, but the general attributes are there.

I'd considered that formation but decided that since JR doesn't seem to be strong I wanted another player near him centrally for support and a pass. It also means one less CB for JR to worry about and would hopefully allow him to find more space than with just wingers. I'm also not sure we'd be Jones first choice as he's done alright here and I can see a PL team offering him some dollar. but you never know, wages maybe an issue as he's a Bosman?

Agreed Maj. For me the position alongside Williamson and 'the voice' you talk about should be Shaun Derry. Hard as nails, been successful in this division before and a leader.

It's imperative we get Kane for at least next season, he's a real prospect, if this means Henley at left back, I'd go with that.

If Kane plays like he has till the end of the season I'd be trying to get him a loan to a higher level if I was Chelsea. I know Henley plays LB but I'm traditional in that sense and what a leftie on the left not a rightie ala henley. I feel that to get the best out of Rhodes we need to have both wingers and full backs capable of putting in a good first time ball and that means the right feet on the right side. We've not had that for seasons.

Aye no two ways about it Derry is a psycho on the pitch. Trouble is he's 35 now and given the wedge he's on at QPR, we might be better of elsewhere. Contracted till the end of next season as well, so perhaps a keeper for QPR when they come down.

[AndyC]

nailed it.

id have the same formation and the same people. olsson mk1 definitely a winger. but hsi confidence needs building up again with a manager who lets him run at players.

Rhodes lack of ability to play as a targetman as Den says is an issue when that's how we want to play. He isn't a brute, he doesn't strike me as aggresive and he's best with it being played to feet. So Den's right as if he can't play that way and that's how we want to play then it's an issue. The ball will keep coming back as was highly evident against Ipswich despite the result and goal. For that style goals only are not enough. But one the flipside the others are right as well in that we've needed his goals this season badly. It's a bit of a catch 22 and one of those you have to weigh up really, drop him for better team-play and lose his goals or change the style? I think Appleton's style wasn't at all suited to Rhodes and he showed no signs of changing developing that, christ he was playing CM's on RW??? Berg, well he made Kean look good, says it all.

I'd like to see us play 4231 with Rhodes at the top and the out ball being the 3 not the 1, but that will require pace in the 3 and for the back 4 and midfield 2 to be mobile and calm in possesion. We are too quick to punt it forward and too compact to expand to play as Appleton set us up. The whole barely covered half a pitch, so it's tight and passing football is tricky. What we need to have is better transition between defending and attacking and players to attack space the second we get possesion back. Bowyer seems to have us playing abit more like this so I'm keen to see where it leads. Next year provided we're not flogging all and sundry and re-using teabags to save pennies I'd like to see this team next year:

Kean

Henley Dann Givet Another

Williamson Another

King Rochina Olsson MKI

Rhodes

I honestly don't think we need that many new players, Hanley backs up CB and O'connell and Edwards as back-up. We need a LB, we haven't had for years, since Warnock as Olsson a winger all day for me. RB you could maybe loan Kane again and shift Henley over, but he's right footed and I like balance in the team foot wise for crossing etc. Williamson sitting alongside another who can play a bit, hence no lowe. Lowe though backs-up RB and CM so that's a bonus. Rochina I rate him and would like to see if we can develop him under someone who actually knows what they're talking about as he's yet to have that at Rovers, he also has that bit of magic and we'll need that. Kings alright and sounded decent against Huddersfield and as long as you bark at him he'll track back. Olsson MKI will do that anyway but he adds in a left foot and pace and when he's played LW he's set-up a few. As long as we have funds and a decent voice leading the lads I honestly think we'd have a chance with that team. Best can back-up Rhodes with Goodwillie Olsson MKII his twins back-up, although I'd want a new player to back-up / push Rochina. Everyone else can leave as loans can cover the injuries in this league with the windows open as they are.

[Steve Moss]

Majiball for Manager!

We aren't getting promoted this season. So we need to be ensuring our Championship survival and preparing for next season.

1. We need to get rid of our deadwood, of which we have more than most due to certain goings on.

2. We need to keep Rhodes, Dann and the other triers in the squad.

3. We don't need that much new blood to make us competitive.

4. We need a decent manager and we might have one in Gary Bower. Let's see what he does over these last four matches.

5. And the single most important item that needs to be taken care of is the boardroom. Agnew, Shaw and Shebby all need to be shown the exit door ASAP and a competent, reliable board brought in pronto!

[perthblue02]

That's all going to happen & the nasty people saying the club is on the very cusp of financial meltdown are making it all up cos Venkys are mega rich and despite having their pants pulled down for 30 months it's all gonna turn out like Disneyland & Jordan's going to stay, Todd wil sign, Danny & Dickson will go and waive what they're owed .... & lashings of ginger beer & cake for everyone!!

uhmm, not sure about that depends what kind of cake it is before I commit .