Tony Mowbray's Reign...& is he off to Sunderland ?

[USABlue]

20 minutes ago, AllRoverAsia said:

A character in Blackadder, always says he has a 'cunning plan' ... lots on YouTube, hilarious.

I think TM is fishing for a contract offer by saying he's going.

I have seen a couple, funny.

[RevidgeBlue]

1 minute ago, Gav said:

Jesus wept…..

Yes you got me, superb owners, we’re lucky to have them.

You're being childish now, you should have stopped after "Yes you got me."

The owners record has been terrible overall, the latest example imo being their consistent refusal to sack your mate Mowbray.

The one thing that can't be discounted over the years however is their financial commitment to the Club. Currently they seemingly do not have any intentions of selling the Club at any point so, given that,  if only that considerable financial support could be channelled properly under the auspices of competent people.

[Gav]

22 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

The one thing that can't be discounted over the years however is their financial commitment to the Club. Currently they seemingly do not have any intentions of selling the Club at any point so, given that,  if only that considerable financial support could be channelled properly under the auspices of competent people.

I recently argued with posters on here that no Blackburn Rovers supporter deserves Venkys, but I take that back, you actually do.

To turn the last 11yrs into some sort of positive is some going….especially when the club is £150m in debt.

 

Edited April 29, 2022 by Gav

[RevidgeBlue]

3 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

Considering it was me that first brought all this to this forum’s attention and repeatedly flagged the Coventry situation, I’m not naive to the possible intentions of certain people  

So surely any responsible owner should’ve been well aware and nipped it in the bud at birth, not let it get all the way to planning permission being requested with RVC, architect plans published, promotional videos with the Chief Exec about it on the club website, interviews with the LT etc etc.

So what kind of owner is that much out of their loop of their own business that it could’ve got that far? Because, they were either in on it, or they are that far out of touch from their own football club that the training ground can be flattened for housing without their knowledge, so I repeat…

‘Either way, after 12 years of owning a football club, it doesn’t put them in a great light, does it?’

 

Fair comment.

I suspected at the time the owners were seduced by talk of a world class state of the art training facility but when the practical difficulties with Waggott's hare brained scheme were brought out into the open they pulled the plug.

Someone must have binned the scheme off and I thought sensitivity might have been shown to the objections of the fans and the local residents.

My worry with that view now is that it might only have been scrapped because it was thought the plan as it stood had no chance of success. There does still seem to be an appetite to consider alternative sites. I would have hoped at the time for a firm commitment the scheme would not be revisited and concrete proposals to upgrade the existing facilities by now.

That said, under a different management regime, tangible plans we can actually see for a new state of the art training complex on a site that is big enough to command Cat 1 Academy Status might have some legs. I just wouldn't have any confidence in the current lot on the ground to deliver it.

[chaddyrovers]

2 hours ago, Paul Mani said:

Well he believed he had the power to sack Mowbray after the Forest game and this was after March 21 which would lead me to think he was a part of the plan to replace Mowbray initially. Also, Mowbray refers to ‘Mr Waggott’ and ‘the men in suits’ as one in an ‘us and them’ context….so I’m assuming Swag IS in the know, even if he’s leaving too!

 

Wasn't it Sheffield United at home actually? 

[RevidgeBlue]

10 minutes ago, Gav said:

I recently argued with posters on here that no Blackburn Rovers supporter deserves Venkys, but I take that back, you actually do.

To turn the last 11yrs into some sort of positive is some going….especially when the club is £150m in debt.

 

No point discussing further with you today, you've deliberately ignored the bit where I said "their record has been terrible overall" for the sake of being contrary.

[Paul Mani]

2 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

If true - why didn't he then?

Probably because we beat Forest and went on 5 game winning run I’d imagine? 🤷🏽‍♂️

[roversfan99]

3 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Yes I would expect the owners to have told Mowbray that he will go after this season or we are going to give him a new contract. 

He has been massive backed over his tenure at the club and he can have no complaints over the budget for each season he got. 

Yes this season he will still allow to sign players and in fact we have made Buckley and Brereton key players for the club. 

The Armstrong money's will be used to cover this season losses. Yes it would have been good to spend more but he has been allowed to make number of permanent signings Football under the PL has seen a massive reset financially at Championship clubs this season

We don't know that. 

Cos its doesn't bothered so much as you and I don't keep going on about i 

PNE performance and the way we played tactical and formation wise so such a positive and attacking position. Its a pity that Mowbray was so stubborn not to change formation/tactics sooner we would have secure a playoff already. I have been going going on for over 3 weeks now. I was right and you were wrong to want to back 3 which was clearly to see need 

I would expect a new appointment to be made by the end of May

Massively backed is hyperbolic in the extreme.

So being backed just means being able to bring in players at all, even just loans despite selling your 15m striker and allowing senior players to leave? That means every club in the world is backed by the owners.

Its a good job he didnt listen to you before Preston otherwise the dynamism would have been swapped for Johnson lugging himself after Preston midfielders.

 

2 hours ago, Paul Mani said:

Here’s my take / opinion based on a few bits I’ve heard and reading between the lines…

So, I KNOW that the training ground was rife with rumours last March that TM was gone at the end of the season, everyone knew. I also heard whispers that they’d interviewed and had maybe chosen one - I suspected Wilder or Neill but never had any confirmation.

For some reason, it didn’t happen. Maybe it was the candidates choice, maybe the clubs choice in terms of the timing for FFP or maybe Venkys decided against it? Who knows? But I do think there was a plan (of sorts) hatched then…

The cutting back, not investing in the summer or in particular at Christmas and the lack of any contact with TM was telling especially with the sale of Arma and the training ground money which puts us in a much better situation from this summer.

I also recall the conversation I had with Waggott after the Forest game when he openly said TM would’ve been sacked if we’d capitulated again like Fulham. Those conversations are signs that the relationship is dead really.

Then we had our hiatus and with it, Waggott and Venkys went quiet. Tony isn’t in the circle of trust anymore.

So, my take is that there’s a plan to restructure this summer, new manager, new regime and money to spend (FFP clear).
 

How good that plan is, who will take it forward, how much money will be spent and how successful it will be are anyones guess. But I do feel the next few weeks will be interesting, if nothing else!

 

Lots of reading between the lines then. That plan is not consistent with anything in the last 12 years.

[LeftWinger]

1 hour ago, Admiral Nelsen said:

For those who don't follow Rugby League, Wigan have just sacked a player for repeatedly failing to meet their professional standards, and they're taking a hit on losing a quality player in order to preserve the culture of success that they're trying to build, shared by players, staff and directors. Wouldn't it be nice to think a similar level of thought has gone into the setup at Rovers. 

They weren't preserving the culture of the club when they took a chance on him after his drugs bans....especially when he was involved in another police incident just after starting training with the club.

[booth]

20 minutes ago, Gav said:

I recently argued with posters on here that no Blackburn Rovers supporter deserves Venkys, but I take that back, you actually do.

To turn the last 11yrs into some sort of positive is some going….especially when the club is £150m in debt.

 

Come on Gav, they are supporting the club financially. It's the only half decent thing they've done. And so they should, it's them that got us into the financial mess in the first place.

They just need to get it into their heads that employing a good manager and supporting them is one of the important things when running a football club. I imagine they are still being advised by people with motives other than bringing in the right manager (£££'s for their clients on the scrapheap).

[RevidgeBlue]

12 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

Probably because we beat Forest and went on 5 game winning run I’d imagine? 🤷🏽‍♂️

Sorry, thought you meant Waggott thought he had authority to sack Mowbray on a date some time after Forest at home this season.

[Admiral Nelsen]

2 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

They weren't preserving the culture of the club when they took a chance on him after his drugs bans....especially when he was involved in another police incident just after starting training with the club.

 

Quite right, it was a mistake to sign him in the first place in my view. 

Still impressed with the way they dealt with his departure though. I suppose that's the point I was trying to make when comparing them to Rovers. They've sacked a player for ill-discipline, but were still very classy about how they dealt with the situation in public and have obviously got the balance right between a duty of care to an employee who has clearly needed support, and making a difficult hard-headed decision in the best interest of the club. Suggests that the decision makers are proactive, treat their employees fairly and are capable of taking difficult decisions. 

Contrast that with Rovers and Mowbray - it seems to be the polar opposite, at least as far as we can tell. 

[Leonard Venkhater]

4 hours ago, JC4LAB said:

Maybe its just canny Venkys waiting to see where we end up this season. .Hes been a good manager in the clubs current financial situation..

"canny Venky's"...Discuss lol

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

6 minutes ago, Admiral Nelsen said:

 

Quite right, it was a mistake to sign him in the first place in my view. 

Still impressed with the way they dealt with his departure though. I suppose that's the point I was trying to make when comparing them to Rovers. They've sacked a player for ill-discipline, but were still very classy about how they dealt with the situation in public and have obviously got the balance right between a duty of care to an employee who has clearly needed support, and making a difficult hard-headed decision in the best interest of the club. Suggests that the decision makers are proactive, treat their employees fairly and are capable of taking difficult decisions. 

Contrast that with Rovers and Mowbray - it seems to be the polar opposite, at least as far as we can tell. 

Whoever signs him next is going to be making the same mistake. I heard he was going to Feth.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Just now, Leonard Venkhater said:

"canny Venky's"...Discuss lol

You don’t see those two words in the same sentence very often.

[MarkBRFC]

7 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Sorry, thought you meant Waggott thought he had authority to sack Mowbray on a date some time after Forest at home this season.

Think Paul is getting his games confused somewhere.

I think he means after the Sheffield Utd game on November 5th rather than the Forest game in Feb. (As after Sheff Utd we went on that ridiculous run that got us to second).

[Leonard Venkhater]

3 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

You don’t see those two words in the same sentence very often.

Quite. I could think of other words, all right!

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Admiral Nelsen said:

For those who don't follow Rugby League, Wigan have just sacked a player for repeatedly failing to meet their professional standards, and they're taking a hit on losing a quality player in order to preserve the culture of success that they're trying to build, shared by players, staff and directors. Wouldn't it be nice to think a similar level of thought has gone into the setup at Rovers. 

Sorry but I'm not having this as a story of morality. There's a lot more to this and I don't think it's accurate to describe it this way. 

[RevidgeBlue]

6 minutes ago, Leonard Venkhater said:

"canny Venky's"...Discuss lol

Yes "canny" is definitely not the right word.

That said being had over is not completely exclusive to them, Dahlin, Ward, Peacock, Dailly, Grabbi, Barry Ferguson, Amoruso etc etc......

[tomphil]

3 hours ago, Paul Mani said:

Here’s my take / opinion based on a few bits I’ve heard and reading between the lines…

So, I KNOW that the training ground was rife with rumours last March that TM was gone at the end of the season, everyone knew. I also heard whispers that they’d interviewed and had maybe chosen one - I suspected Wilder or Neill but never had any confirmation.

For some reason, it didn’t happen. Maybe it was the candidates choice, maybe the clubs choice in terms of the timing for FFP or maybe Venkys decided against it? Who knows? But I do think there was a plan (of sorts) hatched then…

The cutting back, not investing in the summer or in particular at Christmas and the lack of any contact with TM was telling especially with the sale of Arma and the training ground money which puts us in a much better situation from this summer.

I also recall the conversation I had with Waggott after the Forest game when he openly said TM would’ve been sacked if we’d capitulated again like Fulham. Those conversations are signs that the relationship is dead really.

Then we had our hiatus and with it, Waggott and Venkys went quiet. Tony isn’t in the circle of trust anymore.

So, my take is that there’s a plan to restructure this summer, new manager, new regime and money to spend (FFP clear).
 

How good that plan is, who will take it forward, how much money will be spent and how successful it will be are anyones guess. But I do feel the next few weeks will be interesting, if nothing else!

 

Is it possible he wanted out last summer but they couldn't line anyone up and didn't want to pay him off ?

There's be so many times the last 18 months or so that he has looked thoroughly fed up and knackered. He's made noises at times like he didn't give a stuff about anything but keeping the lads happy.  Leading many to believe he was just waiting for or angling for a pay off.

With this in mind they've obviously held off the backing and decided to get FFP in order leading to more sulking this season from him. 

It's not that i don't believe what he's saying it''s just the context of it i got the impression a while ago he's out for himself now.  Damage limitation is in full flow like with most managers and he doesn't want to be seen as retiring just in case there is something on the horizon. Has to try and make it like he's stepping down honorably though, he's a very crafty old fox.

[Mattyblue]

So? Managers sign poor players and waste money, that’s football, in no way is it comparable to this 12 years of farce, you really are scraping the barrel today, Rev 

Edited April 29, 2022 by Mattyblue

[RevidgeBlue]

1 minute ago, Mattyblue said:

So? Managers sign poor players and waste money, that’s football, in no way is it comparable to this 12 years of farce, you really are scraping the barrel today, Rev 

Point is we've been done over by agents in the past pre Venkys as well.

Two wrongs don't make a right though as you correctly point out.

[Admiral Nelsen]

6 minutes ago, JoeH said:

Sorry but I'm not having this as a story of morality. There's a lot more to this and I don't think it's accurate to describe it this way. 

 

To clarify Joe, I wasn't really making a moral point. It was more how you can look at these two recent cases of clubs choosing to get rid of key personnel, and see that the differences between them reveal differences in how professionally they conduct themselves. 

I accept the circumstances are wildly different, but in one instance there's a club that have provided all the professional and support they could to an employee, before a line was crossed and they got rid straight away, and in such a way where they still made very classy and magnanimous public statements about the player. I think this shows a level of professionalism, decisiveness and shared strategy amongst the club's hierarchy that shows Rovers up in how they've dealt with Mowbray as far as we can tell.

I think the lack of professional curtesy is an issue too to be fair, so I guess I'm making a bit of a moral point in that sense, but I mainly worry about what it suggests about how the club is run. 

[Gav]

33 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Yes "canny" is definitely not the right word.

That said being had over is not completely exclusive to them, Dahlin, Ward, Peacock, Dailly, Grabbi, Barry Ferguson, Amoruso etc etc......

Nope the football club in 90’s and 2000’s made occasional mistakes, on both managerial appointments and bad buys, that’s football. But to draw comparisons with these useless inept bastards in Pune is a wind-up surely? 

If only we had John Williams, Roy Hodgson and Souness now.

[Mattyblue]

The very same John Williams that Rev used to consistently slag off, per chance?

Edited April 29, 2022 by Mattyblue