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Stuart

Goalkeeper Situation

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Talk of Hart coming in; Raya out of favour; Leutweiler starting again despite not being a Rover next season.

Just watching them warm up on the pitch and the body language is shocking. The coach looks like he can’t be bothered and is going through the motions. May as well pay Conway to warm up the keepers next season!

Big changes expected in the position next season.

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 Very difficult to predict what’s going to happen here. I thought Raya was a shoe in as one of our ‘two’ next season with Jayson moving on, but I’m really not sure now. Given his public rollicking’s and now being dropped, perhaps Raya is off. I’d have him as number 2, competing with someone experienced who comes in.

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Raya is only 23 which is very young for a goalkeeper that is playing regular. IF he should leave we will regret it. He just need someone to learn from.

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It would appear from the outside that there's been a falling out between Raya and TM, otherwise why would he be completely frozen out for the last four games after being persisted with all season?

I actually thought he'd picked his game up somewhat after being singled out for public criticism  but the next news he's dropped. Very odd.

I echo the sentiments above, when you see the howlers being made week in week out by De Gea and various other keepers costing 50m or 70m I really don't think Raya is that far away from being a top class keeper.

If he is demoted or allowed to leave it will be a monumental blunder imo.

 

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Raya has cost us many points for 2 seasons. I think a significant part of our defensive problems is that the back 4 (whoever they are) do not trust a goalkeeper who consistently fails to dominate his area, is weak on crosses and makes basic errors. I don't see why he won't continue to do the same next season. If we have any pretentions to be top 6 next season we need a new goalkeeper.  Leutweiler needs packing off out of the club - preferably tomorrow.

 

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4 hours ago, Stuart said:

The coach looks like he can’t be bothered and is going through the motions.

That's one position we could definitely cut.

Probably the fitness and conditioning too. We'd be better off using a freelancer (even most level 3 PTs would be better than what we currently have).

This whole set up has been a joke for years.

 

Edited by Husky

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It was theorised that we were putting Leutwiler in the shopping window.

No point, his contract's up this summer.

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Leutweiller has let in two goals during his four match stint which would have been routine stops for Raya and be contrast I don't think he has done anything positive Raya wouldn't have. I doubt we will see the tall Canadian on the bench next season- he doesn't have the ability to get down quickly enough.

I hope Raya gets his nose rebuilt and his noddle sorted so he can be in the Championship team of the season 19/20. He has the raw ability to make it.

It seems probable we will see a new keeper come in and perhaps one Raya will have to work to displace.

Far more important signings are in the defensive positions. Yes Raya has dropped a clanger or two too many but he has been  left horribly exposed by what has or has not been happening in front of him. Get a solid defence which communicates well and I think we will see Raya grow. 

  

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New No.1 keeper desperately needed. Leuts is poor and Raya just never seems to eradicate the costly errors.  

Mowbray wanted one last summer but didn't deliver. He certainly needs one this summer. Hope it's not Hart. 

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I don't think Raya will ever be that good, but the potential is still there to be a decent Championship level keeper. He's still young for his position. We need to bring in a proper keeper for Raya to learn from, and perhaps upgrade the coaching staff too - across the board. I'm not sure what they do on a daily basis but I don't think any of our players have improved on their weaknesses over the course of the season, in some cases they seem to have gotten worse. That points to a lack of direction and/or quality coaching on the training pitch, and is something that could really hinder our younger talents if it isn't addressed soon.

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6 hours ago, Stuart said:

Talk of Hart coming in; Raya out of favour; Leutweiler starting again despite not being a Rover next season.

Just watching them warm up on the pitch and the body language is shocking. The coach looks like he can’t be bothered and is going through the motions. May as well pay Conway to warm up the keepers next season!

Big changes expected in the position next season.

Banged on about this before but used to watch the full warm up routine every match under Bowyer as has to go in ground early then. It was as professional and thorough as I've ever seen with John Keeley warming up Steele and Raya for a full 20 mins probably.  Steele was shite when he came, crap signing, but he improved as time went on then almost immediately Keeley left for some fat dolloper brought in by Lambert he went backwards again. Obviously he was never going to be good but showed signs he might develop into a steady midtable Champ keeper as he got a bit stronger.

If feel Raya would've been a lot steadier had he continued under that coach this lad is just following a manual it must certainly help when you are training under someone experienced who sets high standards and can set and example himself instead of looking like you've dragged one of your pals out the stands to kick balls at you just to limber up.

Piss poor having two bob coaching staff in a set up like ours, very slack. I'm sure he's decent lad doing his best but he's a novice coach training a relatively novice keeper.  No surprise there are certain elements in Raya's game not improving.

Edited by tomphil

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Raya over Canadian. Not sure what the issue is over Raya? Lad is young and had more better games than badder. 

Edited by BankEnd Rover

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Raya #1.

How many games over the past two years has Lenihan missed. We are defensively a different team when he plays as "he loves to head the ball". Raya had to come for everything as otherwise it was a gimme goal as he knew Mulgrew etc wouldn't win the first ball enough.

How many games have we played with Bennett, Bell and Williams at full backs allowing 3 yards for wingers to cross.

How many games have we had Smallwood and Evans play as a pair jogging around the pitch and continuously gifting possession and space to opposition attackers.

Build a team up with a proper CB partner for Lenihan, and keep attacking to defend. Allow Raya to be the sweeper keeper he is and not the 8 men in our own box, keeper.

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39 minutes ago, BankEnd Rover said:

Raya over Canadian. Not sure what the issue is over Raya? Lad is young and had more better games than badder. 

It’s not personal, we just need a keeper who is gooder.

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If we stick with Raya next season, sooner or later he will let us down.  He will cost us vital points that will make the difference between a promotion push and mid-table, or between mid-table and a relegation fight. There's very few successful teams with dodgy keepers, And Raya is dodgy.  

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1 hour ago, tomphil said:

Banged on about this before but used to watch the full warm up routine every match under Bowyer as has to go in ground early then. It was as professional and thorough as I've ever seen with John Keeley warming up Steele and Raya for a full 20 mins probably.  Steele was shite when he came, crap signing, but he improved as time went on then almost immediately Keeley left for some fat dolloper brought in by Lambert he went backwards again. Obviously he was never going to be good but showed signs he might develop into a steady midtable Champ keeper as he got a bit stronger.

If feel Raya would've been a lot steadier had he continued under that coach this lad is just following a manual it must certainly help when you are training under someone experienced who sets high standards and can set and example himself instead of looking like you've dragged one of your pals out the stands to kick balls at you just to limber up.

Piss poor having two bob coaching staff in a set up like ours, very slack. I'm sure he's decent lad doing his best but he's a novice coach training a relatively novice keeper.  No surprise there are certain elements in Raya's game not improving.

I absolutely agree, another top coach was Bobby Mimms who got the bullet soon after Henning Berg arrived. I believe he is now out of football and we could do much worse than persuade him to return

 

 

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Just now, Angry_Pirate said:

Raya #1..

How many games have we played with Bennett, Bell and Williams at full backs allowing 3 yards for wingers to cross.

In the other thread you just said Del can play LB?  Make your mind up mate,   We need rid of Del and Dave for fecks sake can you not see that?

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2 hours ago, Stuart said:

It’s not personal, we just need a keeper who is gooder.

I agree, Joe Hart is definitely not that man though he’s worse than the Canadian these days. 

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I'd love Fraser Forster, well out of favour at Southampton but probably on big money. I have a feeling this is one he might get from the continent. 

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Joe Hart is a no from from me. As is Leutweiler, but good luck to him.

I rate Raya, or at least the pre-West Brom version. Yes he's made basic errors (which experience & better coaching should iron out) and his distribution is erratic, but he's also won us points with some worldie saves that any top flight keeper would be proud of. Our defensive problems & lack of a reliable back 4 will not have helped him  and he is well worth persevering with at least for another couple of seasons. I hope he comes back after summer fully refreshed & with his confidence renewed.

He needs proper coaching & good competition. I like the Darlow shout but feel it's a long shot. Bialkowski might be more realistic, being proven at this level over a few seasons.

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15 hours ago, jim mk2 said:

Raya has cost us many points for 2 seasons. I think a significant part of our defensive problems is that the back 4 (whoever they are) do not trust a goalkeeper who consistently fails to dominate his area, is weak on crosses and makes basic errors. I don't see why he won't continue to do the same next season. If we have any pretentions to be top 6 next season we need a new goalkeeper.  Leutweiler needs packing off out of the club - preferably tomorrow.

 

Personally I think it's the other way round if you have a solid defence you can usually carry a keeper who makes mistakes. If you have a poor defence, the best keeper in the world will have that much to do that they will make mistakes. 

Edited by rigger

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13 hours ago, renrag said:

I absolutely agree, another top coach was Bobby Mimms who got the bullet soon after Henning Berg arrived. I believe he is now out of football and we could do much worse than persuade him to return

 

 

I'd actually forgotten about Mimms so yes could do worse or even Robinson for someone a bit more up to date although not sure what he's doing post Burnley.

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11 hours ago, Butty said:

I agree, Joe Hart is definitely not that man though he’s worse than the Canadian these days. 

IMHO Joe Hart > David Raya, at least for now.

Can we rehabilitate him and get him back to his best? Probably not with our novices coaching him. In any case, it’s a moot point as Mowbray has already pooh-pooh’d Hart moving here.

It’s a key area though and if we do have a budget then the whole set up needs sorting properly. Coaches, first choice and reserve, with a progression plan to bring through young lads. Fisher and Albinson have done well at their level but it doesn’t feel like either is going to threaten the first team any time soon.

Raya looks like being a Championship number 2 - even if he left Rovers. Could he cope mentally with going back to that here? Not sure but what we miss is a commanding keeper who dominates his area, physically and mentally. Since his injury Raya has lost a bit of that bravery and is not the most imposing of characters physically. If he is going to continue then it will ultimately be Lenihan’s job to command the box - which isn’t really where any goalkeeper should want to be.

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