v Bristol City (a) - 4/11/25

[cesus]

28 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

You have hit the nail on the head with Hedges. The criticism has always been unfair. I’ve seen him be called useless and worthless to have on a pitch. Couldn’t be any further from the truth. You can tell he’s the type of player you would love to have on your side - he isn’t obnoxious, he’s not a trouble maker, he works hard and he’s a tidy player too

One bad injury spell aside, he’s been ever present. Must be approaching his 150 apps for us now - all for less than £200k. In his time at the club he’s been ever present under 4 different coaches. In that time, we’ve been a top half club every season except for 23/24, which coincidentally he was injured most of that season.

In no way saying that was the root cause of our issues that season but it does show his importance to this squad. 

I spoke about his importance during the summer and got shot down, my simplistic view is to not view his attacking capabilities (if a manager did he wouldn't play). He stops a full back being overrun and is always willing to be an outlet for the ball, being an outlet to take and hold the ball is far more of a skill than people think.

[bluebruce]

11 minutes ago, cesus said:

I spoke about his importance during the summer and got shot down, my simplistic view is to not view his attacking capabilities (if a manager did he wouldn't play). He stops a full back being overrun and is always willing to be an outlet for the ball, being an outlet to take and hold the ball is far more of a skill than people think.

In the summer he was being looked at as a winger. So assessing his attacking abilities was very much relevant. A defensive winger can serve a purpose occasionally but mostly you need one that can attack, if you haven't got a dire or highly attacking full back behind him.

He looked much more comfortable last night playing as a wingback.

[Exiled_Rover]

48 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

You have hit the nail on the head with Hedges. The criticism has always been unfair. I’ve seen him be called useless and worthless to have on a pitch. Couldn’t be any further from the truth. You can tell he’s the type of player you would love to have on your side - he isn’t obnoxious, he’s not a trouble maker, he works hard and he’s a tidy player too

One bad injury spell aside, he’s been ever present. Must be approaching his 150 apps for us now - all for less than £200k. In his time at the club he’s been ever present under 4 different coaches. In that time, we’ve been a top half club every season except for 23/24, which coincidentally he was injured most of that season.

In no way saying that was the root cause of our issues that season but it does show his importance to this squad. 

I think it just shows how far our standards have fallen.

[RoversTilliDie]

I was saying last week to a fellow Rovers supporters, we need a bit of momentum, before the international break. You can't ask for more, a hat trick of wins, before the Derby game.

[Hasta]

4 hours ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

You have hit the nail on the head with Hedges. The criticism has always been unfair. I’ve seen him be called useless and worthless to have on a pitch. Couldn’t be any further from the truth. You can tell he’s the type of player you would love to have on your side - he isn’t obnoxious, he’s not a trouble maker, he works hard and he’s a tidy player too

My problem with Hedges was when I thought we were close to a squad capable of top 6, I felt Hedges was one of the players who we should have been able to replace and improve upon. He was one of the weaker links when he started.

Now I feel we have a squad that should be bottom half, Hedges becomes a valuable cog. He's one of the few proven Championship players we have.

At no time has he been as useless as some would have you believe, although if you'd have asked me my opinion on the train back from Preston a couple of years ago I'd have given you a different comment !  I think some people gave up with him that night.

[roversfan99]

7 hours ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

You have hit the nail on the head with Hedges. The criticism has always been unfair. I’ve seen him be called useless and worthless to have on a pitch. Couldn’t be any further from the truth. You can tell he’s the type of player you would love to have on your side - he isn’t obnoxious, he’s not a trouble maker, he works hard and he’s a tidy player too

One bad injury spell aside, he’s been ever present. Must be approaching his 150 apps for us now - all for less than £200k. In his time at the club he’s been ever present under 4 different coaches. In that time, we’ve been a top half club every season except for 23/24, which coincidentally he was injured most of that season.

In no way saying that was the root cause of our issues that season but it does show his importance to this squad. 

Its not always been unfair. From an attacking position, throughout his time here he has failed to contribute anywhere near enough. His effort is always there but thats not enough to avoid warranted criticism. Maybe at times that criticism has been hyperbolic but hes not done enough for general criticism to have some merit to it.

I think playing him as a wing back really suits him though because there arent those same expectations going forward.

You touch on the terrible 23/24 season not being because he was injured. That certainly is correct, even for Venkys it was a particularly terrible season in terms of off the field stuf.

[USABlue]

Why is there no match replay on Rivers TV.  Anyone know where zi can see it?

[RevidgeBlue]

7 hours ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

You have hit the nail on the head with Hedges. The criticism has always been unfair. I’ve seen him be called useless and worthless to have on a pitch. Couldn’t be any further from the truth. You can tell he’s the type of player you would love to have on your side - he isn’t obnoxious, he’s not a trouble maker, he works hard and he’s a tidy player too

One bad injury spell aside, he’s been ever present. Must be approaching his 150 apps for us now - all for less than £200k. In his time at the club he’s been ever present under 4 different coaches. In that time, we’ve been a top half club every season except for 23/24, which coincidentally he was injured most of that season.

In no way saying that was the root cause of our issues that season but it does show his importance to this squad. 

Blimey not half some revisionism going on here - Sorry, Hedges is an absolute shocker.

Corry Evans, Jason Lowe and Sam Gallagher enjoyed extended periods at the Club as well for some unknown reason.

[USABlue]

On 04/11/2025 at 13:25, RevidgeBlue said:

Weirdly enough I thought De Neve had one of his better games first half on Saturday. And ends up getting substituted at half time, singled out for criticism in Public and dropped for the next game.

Yes Rev some of VI's subs just do not make sense to me.  Recently he oulled Ohashi and he was looking most likely to get us anything many more too.  Like bringing on BigMac.and taking off the olayers who might be able to provide crosses 

[USABlue]

On 04/11/2025 at 14:40, ... said:

Poor Yuki took a battering in that half

He gets a lot of rough treatment and no protection from Refs yet he gets called for "flooring" 6ft 6in built like brickshithouse defenders he's what 5'-6".  Noticed Frankie Lampards Japanese player got lots of calls.  Just the way it is, no conspiracy, just odd.

[47er]

6 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Blimey not half some revisionism going on here - Sorry, Hedges is an absolute shocker.

Corry Evans, Jason Lowe and Sam Gallagher enjoyed extended periods at the Club as well for some unknown reason.

Overall I'd agree that Hedges has disappointed but he has played better this season in a role he's more accustomed to.

[Herbie6590]

Bit late on here with this but the POTM was Yuki…

[Dreams of 1995]

7 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Blimey not half some revisionism going on here - Sorry, Hedges is an absolute shocker.

Corry Evans, Jason Lowe and Sam Gallagher enjoyed extended periods at the Club as well for some unknown reason.

I can't say I would put Hedges in that list of players. Evans and Lowe in particular were part of poor Rovers squads.

Hedges is not a shocker though. In this 3 full seasons we challenged for play offs twice. In the season we didn't, he was injured for the most part. Generally Hedges puts in very good performances. The reason he is at this level is because he struggles to turn those good performances in to goals and assists

We look a better side with Hedges in it. I think you are being very harsh and perhaps you are judging Hedges as though we are a top level side now. Relative to the Championship, Hedges is a top table player who is ever present and has a fantastic level of fitness and work rate. 

[roversfan99]

4 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

I can't say I would put Hedges in that list of players. Evans and Lowe in particular were part of poor Rovers squads.

Hedges is not a shocker though. In this 3 full seasons we challenged for play offs twice. In the season we didn't, he was injured for the most part. Generally Hedges puts in very good performances. The reason he is at this level is because he struggles to turn those good performances in to goals and assists

We look a better side with Hedges in it. I think you are being very harsh and perhaps you are judging Hedges as though we are a top level side now. Relative to the Championship, Hedges is a top table player who is ever present and has a fantastic level of fitness and work rate. 

RevidgeBlue goes over the top but he ie not a "top table player." Having fantastic fitness and work rate is not enough. He has been so poor in the final third offering next to nothing as a winger and his general play is not as good as you suggest. He always works hard and will work back but that is not enough to avoid criticism or be as crucial as you suggest.

Also, this narrative that his absence led in any way to that terrible season is totally disingenous. The owners totally pulled the rug from under us that year, our squad was stripped of experience, we barely had any players hence why the likes of Markanday and Garrett played so many minutes, the manager clearly didnt want to be here. It wasnt because Hedges got injured.

[oneandycrawford]

18 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

RevidgeBlue goes over the top but he ie not a "top table player." Having fantastic fitness and work rate is not enough. He has been so poor in the final third offering next to nothing as a winger and his general play is not as good as you suggest. He always works hard and will work back but that is not enough to avoid criticism or be as crucial as you suggest.

Also, this narrative that his absence led in any way to that terrible season is totally disingenous. The owners totally pulled the rug from under us that year, our squad was stripped of experience, we barely had any players hence why the likes of Markanday and Garrett played so many minutes, the manager clearly didnt want to be here. It wasnt because Hedges got injured.

This feels like the balanced view of Hedges - useful player to have in the squad and for circumstances like Tuesday night. But not someone who will make us a promotion outfit.

RevidgeBlue seems to have a view that if a player isn't creative he doesn't add to the team - Hedges fits that bill, as does his contrarian view on Tronstad. He probably wouldn't have had Nobby Stiles anywhere near the World Cup wining team 😉

[Dreams of 1995]

35 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

RevidgeBlue goes over the top but he ie not a "top table player." Having fantastic fitness and work rate is not enough. He has been so poor in the final third offering next to nothing as a winger and his general play is not as good as you suggest. He always works hard and will work back but that is not enough to avoid criticism or be as crucial as you suggest.

Also, this narrative that his absence led in any way to that terrible season is totally disingenous. The owners totally pulled the rug from under us that year, our squad was stripped of experience, we barely had any players hence why the likes of Markanday and Garrett played so many minutes, the manager clearly didnt want to be here. It wasnt because Hedges got injured.

We can sit and argue about the subjectiveness of this but here's some facts: in 3 full seasons we have challenged for the play off positions twice (missing out narrowly). In those 2 seasons Hedges played 40+ games. In the season we came bottom half, Hedges barely played. They are facts. So the suggestion he is not a top half player is wrong.

I can see you are keen to make sure any praise for Hedges is met with (what do you term it?) "justified criticism". We all know. You have spent 4 years telling us Hedges is crap. He isn't.

And btw, it is disingenuous to suggest that I am making out like missing Hedges caused the struggles that season. I started the debate with Rev by saying it is not the root cause. Don't spin it to suit yourself

Edited 3 hours ago by Dreams of 1995

[roversfan99]

2 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

We can sit and argue about the subjectiveness of this but here's some facts: in 3 full seasons we have challenged for the play off positions twice (missing out narrowly). In those 2 seasons Hedges played 40+ games. In the season we came bottom half, Hedges barely played. They are facts. So the suggestion he is not a top half player is wrong.

I can see you are keen to make sure any praise for Hedges is met with (what do you term it?) "justified criticism". We all know. You have spent 4 years telling us Hedges is crap. He isn't.

And btw, it is disingenuous to suggest that I am making out like missing Hedges caused the struggles that season. I started the debate with Rev by saying it is not the root cause. Don't spin it to suit yourself

I acknowledged yesterday that you did suggest that it wasnt a direct result of Hedges' absence. But you do keep mentioning it suggesting that it is in your mind a factor.

Its a difficult conversation to deny that a player who has regularly been in teams in the top half isnt a top half player but to suggest he is that level does imply that all players contribute equally to league position. Jason Lowe has been mentioned, he was a mainstay in a few seasons where we just missed out on the play offs, that would suggest hes equally a top half player as Rhodes was for example.

As a winger, he has consistently failed to contribute anywhere enough going forward. He doesnt score goals, he doesnt create goals, he doesnt provide any individuality and often makes poor decisions.

He works hard, has a good engine, and shows good tactical discipline and endevaour to protect the defence. Him at wing back makes much more sense. As a winger, I stand by my opinion that he is not good enough.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

I’m not a fan of his as an out and out winger. He isn’t particularly quick, he doesn’t seem to have a trick or two in his locker, he’s not particularly aggressive, he doesn’t have many assists and he certainly doesn’t score enough goals. Where he’s playing now gets the best out of him,.

He’s diligent in regards to positional play, he’ll do all the running that is required for that position, his passing is fairly good, he doesn’t get on the wrong side of the officials so he doesn’t have to worry about yellow cards reducing his effectiveness. 

The left wing back shirt is his at the moment as far as I can see.

[oneandycrawford]

58 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

I’m not a fan of his as an out and out winger. He isn’t particularly quick, he doesn’t seem to have a trick or two in his locker, he’s not particularly aggressive, he doesn’t have many assists and he certainly doesn’t score enough goals. Where he’s playing now gets the best out of him,.

He’s diligent in regards to positional play, he’ll do all the running that is required for that position, his passing is fairly good, he doesn’t get on the wrong side of the officials so he doesn’t have to worry about yellow cards reducing his effectiveness. 

The left wing back shirt is his at the moment as far as I can see.

Thanks Tyrone - best post so far on Hedges.

[K-Hod]

1 hour ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

I’m not a fan of his as an out and out winger. He isn’t particularly quick, he doesn’t seem to have a trick or two in his locker, he’s not particularly aggressive, he doesn’t have many assists and he certainly doesn’t score enough goals. Where he’s playing now gets the best out of him,.

He’s diligent in regards to positional play, he’ll do all the running that is required for that position, his passing is fairly good, he doesn’t get on the wrong side of the officials so he doesn’t have to worry about yellow cards reducing his effectiveness. 

The left wing back shirt is his at the moment as far as I can see.

I think this is a cracking summary, to be honest.

Like others, I've been critical of his attacking output (numbers aren't great, let's be honest), but he does have other qualities and I think he has looked his best for us so far in that wing back position. 

It certainly brings out the best in him, in my view.

[Dreams of 1995]

1 hour ago, roversfan99 said:

I acknowledged yesterday that you did suggest that it wasnt a direct result of Hedges' absence. But you do keep mentioning it suggesting that it is in your mind a factor.

Its a difficult conversation to deny that a player who has regularly been in teams in the top half isnt a top half player but to suggest he is that level does imply that all players contribute equally to league position. Jason Lowe has been mentioned, he was a mainstay in a few seasons where we just missed out on the play offs, that would suggest hes equally a top half player as Rhodes was for example.

As a winger, he has consistently failed to contribute anywhere enough going forward. He doesnt score goals, he doesnt create goals, he doesnt provide any individuality and often makes poor decisions.

He works hard, has a good engine, and shows good tactical discipline and endevaour to protect the defence. Him at wing back makes much more sense. As a winger, I stand by my opinion that he is not good enough.

It's not me that keeps mentioning it. The record books do

It is not true about Jason Lowe either. We came bottom half in our first season in the Championship; then we came close under Bowyer. The following seasons he did not feature much. Then he became captain and that season we got relegated

[ageoftherover]

Re Hedges, theres no player in this division who isn't limited in some way. The key to getting out of a league like this isn't assembling a squad of premier league quality players. It's getting players in positions where their strengths are accentuated and their flaws are not as relevant. Thats more straightforward with a competent back office/owners, but VI seems to have done that with a few players regardless, eg Hedges, De Neve, Cantwell, Miller. It's in no small part due to him being willing to make a significant change to our formation, which isn't the kind of flexibility you often see from modern coaches, with JDT immediately coming to mind.