v Preston North End (h) - 10/12/2022

[tomphil]

6 minutes ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

Defeatism.

Common sense more like.

Demanding 100% is a minimum requirement but expecting players to perform a style of football that is beyond some of them and alien to others is a sure fire way to defeat.

That's defeatism and we have plenty of them.

[Mashed Potatoes]

Just now, tomphil said:

Common sense more like.

Demanding 100% is a minimum requirement but expecting players to perform a style of football that is beyond some of them and alien to others is a sure fire way to defeat.

That's defeatism and we have plenty of them.

Like the prayer says - grant me powers equal to my tasks not tasks equal to my powers.

[jim mk2]

2 minutes ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

Clubs fail when cabals in the dressing room decide what happen. Manchester United backed Ferguson in sorting out what he inherited and got their reward.

 

Clubs fail when they're badly run. Teams fail when the manager isn't good enough. In a normal club if the players are in revolt the chairman would act. But we are not a normal club. I hope you're not suggesting Tomasson is another Ferguson in the making

[tomphil]

1 minute ago, jim mk2 said:

 

A player who might have thrived with Tomasson's way of playing is Joe Rothwell (late of this parish). He was at his best running at pace with the ball from deep - and he would have had plenty of opportunities under the current set-up. This isn't a Rothwell love-in - he was very inconsistent and could go missing in games - but we don't have a player like that now.

I agree, put a fit Corry Evans or Trybull in there with Rothwell and they would look more comfortable on the ball.  

We've been there before, those ships have sailed and we didn't really have anything but stability to show for it.

[tomphil]

1 minute ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

Like the prayer says - grant me powers equal to my tasks not tasks equal to my powers.

Prayers fall on deaf ears because they are fantasy just like the fantasy football our head coach is asking of these players.

[Mashed Potatoes]

5 minutes ago, jim mk2 said:

 

Clubs fail when they're badly run. Teams fail when the manager isn't good enough. In a normal club if the players are in revolt the chairman would act. But we are not a normal club. I hope you're not suggesting Tomasson is another Ferguson in the making

Tomasson's record in the game,both as manager and player, commands respect - a great deal more than any of the players who may, or may not, be resisting his requirements.

At any normal club, I suspect the chairman looks at the players and then the manager - and decides who commands the greater respect. I know where I stand. What about you ?

[jim mk2]

10 minutes ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

Tomasson's record in the game,both as manager and player, commands respect - a great deal more than any of the players who may, or may not, be resisting his requirements.

At any normal club, I suspect the chairman looks at the players and then the manager - and decides who commands the greater respect. I know where I stand. What about you ?

At any normal club, results on the pitch would decide. At any normal club, the manager would pay the price when they are no longer acceptable. If Tomasson has "lost" the dressing room, as someone reported,  poor results and poor performances will follow. Some would say that has already started and at any normal club, Tomasson would soon be shown the door. But Rovers is not a normal club 

 

[Crimpshrine]

45 minutes ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

Let's be winners - I was. Champions League winner, record goalscorer for my country, playing top flight football across Europe, playing in 2 world cups, winning 2 titles as a manager - match that .

No, go along with those whose collective achievements are like 1% of that.

That way disaster lies.

 

It's not Top Trumps!

A manager's past playing career counts for nothing and doesn't necessarily make him a good manager. Ferguson won nothing as a player but, as a manager,  had the respect of some of the world's greatest players - so it's a nonsense argument.

The players are allowed to have an opinion on the style of football he is asking them to play and are well within their rights to point out it doesn't seem to be working.

[Mashed Potatoes]

13 minutes ago, Crimpshrine said:

It's not Top Trumps!

A manager's past playing career counts for nothing and doesn't necessarily make him a good manager. Ferguson won nothing as a player but, as a manager,  had the respect of some of the world's greatest players - so it's a nonsense argument.

The players are allowed to have an opinion on the style of football he is asking them to play and are well within their rights to point out it doesn't seem to be working.

It's about the manager being allowed to manage - if the players had any achievements to their name perhaps some importance could be attributed to their opinion- but they have none and the manager does.

[roversfan99]

If only the likes of Klopp, Mourinho and Wenger had realised that their lack of outstanding playing careers was so important prior to being such good managers.

[Exiled in Toronto]

The players who are failing now were failing even worse the first five months of this year, irrespective of who’s in the dugout. There is zero chance a lost dressing room of proven chokers will get a manager fired six months into his tenure, they’ll just get themselves shipped out. 

Edited December 12, 2022 by Exiled in Toronto

[Exiled in Toronto]

6 hours ago, bigbrandjohn said:

Good analysis of how half baked our system is. 
 

https://www.lancs.live/sport/football/football-news/blackburn-rovers-tomasson-tactical-gamble-25729553

I’m not sure I agree with much of that.

The first goal was a crap pass made under not much pressure by Wharton, and not for the first time this season or last. The second was a ludicrous choice by Kaminski and a crap player being very crap. The third Hyam got sucked out wide so Wharton HAS to tie up Evans, but doesn’t. The 4th they all dozed off.

The Dack marooned upfront point doesn’t stand up at all if you look at the heatmap.

My rule of thumb is that when Hedges isn’t in the front 3 and when Brereton stands on the touchline the whole game, we lose badly. Add in a system which exposes crap players then we get a debacle.

[rigger]

2 hours ago, jim mk2 said:

 

A player who might have thrived with Tomasson's way of playing is Joe Rothwell (late of this parish). He was at his best running at pace with the ball from deep - and he would have had plenty of opportunities under the current set-up. This isn't a Rothwell love-in - he was very inconsistent and could go missing in games - but we don't have a player like that now.

On the contrary, we have too many players like that.

[47er]

2 hours ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

Cabals in dressing rooms need to be rooted out - even clubs like Liverpool and Manchester United found that out.

Suppose there's a cabal of eleven?

[47er]

2 hours ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

I know where I stand.

We know where you stand, its where you always stand. Everything the club does is OK.

Crisis? What crisis?

[Exiled in Toronto]

2 hours ago, 47er said:

We know where you stand, its where you always stand. Everything the club does is OK.

Crisis? What crisis?

A much under-used word on here! 

[Miller11]

6 hours ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

Let's be winners - I was. Champions League winner, record goalscorer for my country, playing top flight football across Europe, playing in 2 world cups, winning 2 titles as a manager - match that .

No, go along with those whose collective achievements are like 1% of that.

That way disaster lies.

 

None of us can match that gaffer, but did you achieve all that as part of teams that played the way you are trying to instil in us?

 

No.

[lraC]

9 hours ago, Miller11 said:

None of us can match that gaffer, but did you achieve all that as part of teams that played the way you are trying to instil in us?

 

No.

As I have previously said, give the hod carrier the job of building the wall and you will see a disaster.

We simply do not have the players to do what the manger wants, so he needs to accept that and change it.

[Rover_in_the_South]

I was out the country but for the first time in as long as I can remember I didn't even know we were playing Sat. Perhaps a sign my optimism/interest has already diminished.

Don't think I will follow so closely for the remainder. 

So disappointing to of lost to all the clubs around us already this season. 

[dingles staying down 4ever]

19 hours ago, jim mk2 said:

 

A player who might have thrived with Tomasson's way of playing is Joe Rothwell (late of this parish). He was at his best running at pace with the ball from deep - and he would have had plenty of opportunities under the current set-up. This isn't a Rothwell love-in - he was very inconsistent and could go missing in games - but we don't have a player like that now.

But our Head coach doesn't want to run with the ball, he wants us to pass our way as the ball travels quicker than a player dribbling. Shame the passing is across our own box or even deeper.

[Sparks Rover]

52 minutes ago, dingles staying down 4ever said:

But our Head coach doesn't want to run with the ball, he wants us to pass our way as the ball travels quicker than a player dribbling. Shame the passing is across our own box or even deeper.

I think ideally he would like a pivoting midfielder to take the initiative,  we don't possess one.  JR may well have been that man.  Irrespective of his dribbling ability, he is a technically superior player to Captain Fantastic.

[Andy]

I'm as deeply unhappy about the last two results and performances as anyone.

But to be calling for the manager's head, when he's been here for several months (and we do still sit 3rd in the table, halfway through the season) is beyond batshit crazy.

JDT was clear on this when he took over; we're going to be inconsistent and sometimes shit, but give him 3 transfer windows to get the squad how he wants it and then judge him.

To even consider binning him now is Venky-ing of the highest order.

[roversfan99]

How many people have gone as far as calling for the managers head?

[MarkBRFC]

20 hours ago, Andy said:

I'm as deeply unhappy about the last two results and performances as anyone.

But to be calling for the manager's head, when he's been here for several months (and we do still sit 3rd in the table, halfway through the season) is beyond batshit crazy.

JDT was clear on this when he took over; we're going to be inconsistent and sometimes shit, but give him 3 transfer windows to get the squad how he wants it and then judge him.

To even consider binning him now is Venky-ing of the highest order.

?

Venkys don't sack managers. 2 in the last 10 years,

To want him out is surely the complete opposite of that?!

[Waggy76]

On 14/12/2022 at 13:36, roversfan99 said:

How many people have gone as far as calling for the managers head?

If he was sacked tomorrow , I don't think too many fans would be bothered ...I for one would be delighted...