v Plymouth Argyle (a) - 2/9/23

[Exiled_Rover]

11 minutes ago, Gav said:

Pears was very good in goal for large parts of last season, JDT clearly rates him too.

He was written off on here after Wigan away in the cup, let’s not write him off again after 1 bad game.

One bad game? His positioning cost us a point against Hull.

[JohnD]

As much as I like JDT and the football this team play ...... this team has "thrown the towel in" far more often than any other Rovers team in my (long) lifetime.

At this rate, under these owners, that may be their legacy.

[rigger]

36 minutes ago, Jimmy612 said:

Has Rigger deleted the post you quoted? I can't see it on the timeline.

Perhaps realised it's one of the worst posts in the history of the MB. He was out for the last 3 months of the season, he's been involved in most match days and has played in the league cup, to very good effect. 

JDT is the coach, he was appointed to take charge of first team football affairs, and part of that role is to do with his squad what he sees fit. If, all of a sudden first team players are being sent on loan without his agreement, then it massively undermines his position.  Travis was left out for a good portion of last season, and was brought back in when JDT thought he could best effect our performances.  

What's next?  The team news gets faxed over from India? Waggott dangling (ooooh matron) over the box shouting tactics or making substitutions?  

As was pointed out to me JDT may not have been irked by Buckley going on loan. But by the fact that there was no incoming player.

[sharpysharps86]

3 minutes ago, JohnD said:

As much as I like JDT and the football this team play ...... this team has "thrown the towel in" far more often than any other Rovers team in my (long) lifetime.

At this rate, under these owners, that may be their legacy.

Have they thrown the towel in more often though? Rovers under Bowyer in 2013/14 and 2014/15 were arguably a much better side than what we have right now, and should have been quite comfortably in the playoffs ATLEAST with the goals scored by Gestede and Rhodes. I'd suggest that team was worse for bottling it than this current group. They definitely choked in a fair few games.

Mowbray's 2020/21 squad with a forward line of Brereton, Armstrong and Harvey Elliott was another one....finished 15th that season if I recall, including losing 5 on the spin!

[Mattyblue]

To me the common denominator has been  the lack of leadership and accountability on and off the pitch throughout this reign of terror.

[Gav]

18 minutes ago, Exiled_Rover said:

One bad game? His positioning cost us a point against Hull.

How many games did he keep us in last season? How many games did we win because of his saves? 

Bad day at the office yesterday and posters are looking for a scapegoat as they did after Wigan and we know how that ended up….

[47er]

1 hour ago, Jimmy612 said:

This is a massive concern. Seemingly no-one consulted with JDT, which I'm gobsmacked about (I know, I'm a fool).  Whilst JDT doesn't take day to day responsibility for the transfers in and out, he has to have the final say on his squad. GB spoke very clearly about how involved he is in selecting transfer targets and speaking to players before any transfers reach a conclusion. To let a first team player leave without his say so is a shambles. 

I'm sure GB will address this in his usual post-window interview, but on the face it this looks like another deadline day cock-up and another nail in the coffin of the managers tenure. 

Conspiracy: was GB involved in the last minute Buckley departure or was it another cloak and dagger budget cut decision in an already depressingly belt tightening summer? There has to be some accountability, and GBs interview has to address who had the final say on this. If he wasn't involved either then it's further evidence that the owners are meddling in affairs they shouldn't be, probably via Waggott or Pasha, which totally undermines the DoF model.

It may be that Waggot and Co simply have a set of financial instructions to work to so the owners don't have to meddle at all.

Blissfully absent.

[Moptop1]

The main problem is accountability. No one seems to care. We just keep going around in the same circles. It’s tiresome. 

[Jimmy612]

19 minutes ago, rigger said:

As was pointed out to me JDT may not have been irked by Buckley going on loan. But by the fact that there was no incoming player.

Not the point. The conditions were clear - if Buckley goes he needs to be replaced, if not, as JDT said yesterday, he's a good player and we need good players. All this nonsense about "should have played him more" is churlish. 

[Gav]

26 minutes ago, JohnD said:

As much as I like JDT and the football this team play ...... this team has "thrown the towel in" far more often than any other Rovers team in my (long) lifetime.

At this rate, under these owners, that may be their legacy.

Sorry JohnD but that simply isn’t true in my opinion, in fact far from it. Mowbrays sides had a habit of surrendering leads, you could say at times throwing in the towel, but not JDT’s.

You’re watching a different side to me.

Edited September 3, 2023 by Gav

[chaddyrovers]

Firstly, A very disappointing result given the amount of good chances we created during the game we should have scored first and when we didn't and they scored that deflected shot I did wonder if it was going to be one of those game when we creating loads but fail to convert them and they win. Even at 1 nil I thought we would score at some time and get something from the game. I won't be going OTT about the result or performance. We beat Watford when very few gave us a chance and most people thought we would win yesterday. 

On the 3rd goal, Pears's header was very poor so was Scott Wharton's header also is very poor. Its a situation we shouldn't be conceding from to be honest. I can understand your concerns @Bbrovers2288as you asked me earlier in the thread. I think its time for a change of keeper and give Leo Wahlstedt that keeper jersey for the Boro game. I would also make a couple more changes aswell for that game by bringing in Tronstad for Travis and  Telalovic for Gallagher. Plus Hill and Sigurdsson on the bench. I will post me team line up in Boro thread shortly  

1 hour ago, Tugayisgod said:

If ever proof were needed that a week is a long time in football, I think Rovers have just confirmed the fact.

From the euphoria of an excellent dogged display against Watford and THAT Hedges goal , coupled with our largest ever away win in the cup, to a disappointing result (though not display by all accounts) and THAT Hedges miss yesterday.

Along with a transfer window that may take a little while yet to determine it's success or otherwise, I think the jury is still out.

It's a long old season and the fact the Nobbers are top at the moment , along with some strange results yesterday, show there is nothing to really fear in this league

Yes the championship is wide open and we have seen so far. 

[Oldgregg86]

Having seen the extended highlights pears was every bit the poor keeper I know him to be. The ones he saved he flapped at clumsily. The second goal cannot be palmed back into that area, first rule of goalkeeping away from the goal. The third one, Jesus, another mix up similar to the Millwall game. He has to command his box, shout and take full responsibility for that ball if he’s going to come for it. However why he came for it, again like at the den, I have no idea. Again positionally wrong . He wil cost us a lot of points this season if he isn’t dropped immediately. He isn’t good enough simple as. 

The first goal Wharton could have done better. His languid style isn’t as endearing when we haven’t got the ball. I noticed it in his last game to.

With all that shambles going on defensively we simply have to start taking our chances . They aren’t half chances they are open goals, one on ones and it’s amateurish. They don’t even test the goalkeeper. 
 

I hope to god this Bosnian has something about him, Leo is the lion we desperately need and sigurdsson has abit more composure than the rest of the lads . 
 

Going to be an interesting few weeks seeing how we cope when the new lads get settled in

Edited September 3, 2023 by Oldgregg86

[roversfan99]

The goal at Millwall split people as to whether Pears took any blame, obviously Pickering didn't deal with it but those of us questioning Pears also pointed to the fact that indecision between him and the defence had happened a few times in the weeks before albeit never leading to a goal, but often unnecessary and dangerous set pieces deep in our half. He has a big weakness in communication with his defence when the ball goes in behind.

His spill for the second actually was a second one in 5/10 minutes albeit the first luckily only led to a corner.

The only reason anyone said he was on par/better than Kaminski was to echo the choice of the manager.

 

[sharpysharps86]

To echo the general consensus on here, it is definitely time for Pears to be dropped. He's a decent backup who covered well enough for Kaminski last season but mistakes have gradually been creeping in since the back end of last season. Some of his better saves have papered over those cracks.

I've said it before; you don't spend money on a new keeper with a cap for his country just to have him sit on the bench when the whole point of signing him is to buy cheap, build up his value and sell for big money if he does well enough. I've no doubt that there will be bumps along the way as there often is when you're trying to play out from the back, but I feel like Leo oozes the confidence that's needed.

[Cherry Blue]

59 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

....... bringing in Tronstad for Travis and  Telalovic for Gallagher. Plus Hill and Sigurdsson on the bench. I will post me team line up in Boro thread shortly  

Yes the championship is wide open and we have seen so far. 

Not saying your wrong chaddy but this means a change of captain. Should a team be built around the captain?? Travis did have a bad game along with the whole team but by dropping him JDT needs a new leader. I agree with leadership but how good is this  on the pitch coming from Travis?? Time will tell & it's JDT's call.

[booth]

3 hours ago, Jimmy612 said:

Has Rigger deleted the post you quoted? I can't see it on the timeline.

Perhaps realised it's one of the worst posts in the history of the MB. He was out for the last 3 months of the season, he's been involved in most match days and has played in the league cup, to very good effect. 

JDT is the coach, he was appointed to take charge of first team football affairs, and part of that role is to do with his squad what he sees fit. If, all of a sudden first team players are being sent on loan without his agreement, then it massively undermines his position.  Travis was left out for a good portion of last season, and was brought back in when JDT thought he could best effect our performances.  

What's next?  The team news gets faxed over from India? Waggott dangling (ooooh matron) over the box shouting tactics or making substitutions?  

He must have.

[chaddyrovers]

30 minutes ago, Cherry Blue said:

Not saying your wrong chaddy but this means a change of captain. Should a team be built around the captain?? Travis did have a bad game along with the whole team but by dropping him JDT needs a new leader. I agree with leadership but how good is this  on the pitch coming from Travis?? Time will tell & it's JDT's call.

Not really for me. Hyam would be my captain anyway. 

[philipl]

I can't completely rationalise it but the Hedges miss and Leonard air kick gave me nightmares last night.

[simongarnerisgod]

22 minutes ago, philipl said:

I can't completely rationalise it but the Hedges miss and Leonard air kick gave me nightmares last night.

the fact we are creating easy chances and fluffing them time and time again is also causing me consternation

[tomphil]

3 hours ago, JohnD said:

As much as I like JDT and the football this team play ...... this team has "thrown the towel in" far more often than any other Rovers team in my (long) lifetime.

At this rate, under these owners, that may be their legacy.

True we  seem to have had more 3 goal + spankings in the last year or so than several years before.

I think some of it is down to they do try to get back into it when a goal or two behind and he does throw on attackers.  Mowbray was a bit more pragmatic and seemed to have a liking of losing 0-1 and dominating possession stats instead.

We do have a ridiculous track record of getting back into or turning around games though, weak mentality and it isn't good enough. Only so many times you can blame lack of experience there are plenty players out there with a lot of games between them at various levels.

[JohnD]

3 hours ago, Gav said:

Sorry JohnD but that simply isn’t true in my opinion, in fact far from it. Mowbrays sides had a habit of surrendering leads, you could say at times throwing in the towel, but not JDT’s.

You’re watching a different side to me.

Possibly but I'd say TMs teams only played 15 or 20 minutes per match as normal.

JDTs version almost down tools in comparison, especially last season.

I'm not suggesting it was.like the first Burnley match last season but, after we conceded yesterday there was a distinct lack of "Labore"

I guess yesterday after the budget cuts and last day striker was perhaps disheartening for the squad as well as me.

 

[Exiled_Rover]

59 minutes ago, philipl said:

I can't completely rationalise it but the Hedges miss and Leonard air kick gave me nightmares last night.

I had my head in my hands for their entire counter attack after that Leonard miss. 

That's my big worry about him - we know his limitations physically (about 5'11", quick enough [but not fast], and very athletic), but I don't know how clinical he is. I really thought we'd get him out on loan this window - especially if Gallagher is preferred to him as a #9.

[Exiled_Rover]

36 minutes ago, JohnD said:

Possibly but I'd say TMs teams only played 15 or 20 minutes per match as normal.

JDTs version almost down tools in comparison, especially last season.

I'm not suggesting it was.like the first Burnley match last season but, after we conceded yesterday there was a distinct lack of "Labore"

I guess yesterday after the budget cuts and last day striker was perhaps disheartening for the squad as well as me.

 

Mate, we absolutely battered them. You don't get opposing fans almost universally saying "that was a mugging" in this day and age unless it was blatant. 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

4 hours ago, sharpysharps86 said:

Have they thrown the towel in more often though? Rovers under Bowyer in 2013/14 and 2014/15 were arguably a much better side than what we have right now, and should have been quite comfortably in the playoffs ATLEAST with the goals scored by Gestede and Rhodes. I'd suggest that team was worse for bottling it than this current group. They definitely choked in a fair few games.

Mowbray's 2020/21 squad with a forward line of Brereton, Armstrong and Harvey Elliott was another one....finished 15th that season if I recall, including losing 5 on the spin!

We’ve been “ throwing the towel in “ more or less since the Chicken Chokers rocked up. Is that a coincidence - no. As other people have commented on - there a complete lack of responsibility at the club from top to bottom.

[broadsword]

It tends to be the sides heading for a fall that get mugged, in recollection. Who can forget getting done one nil by Crewe after thing then a total lashing.

 

Plucky losers are still losers. Having said that, we did turn over Watford the previous week. But even so, I think we've actually got weaker. Guess it's early days, we shall see, but we appear to be getting run into the ground. You keep on trimming, you end up with nothing